Noah and the Rapture
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Did Jesus give a hint as to the season of the rapture? Jesus said we would not know the day or hour, because the Hebrew calendar varies, depending on the moon, and the barley harvest. But once the season is here, can we get a clue as to the day?
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Shared (information found) by: Silvan Wolf
Original Blog:
Some Possibly Important News…
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Excerpt:
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Something I read this week in Genesis I have been meaning to follow up on, but have repeatedly forgotten. The Holy Spirit has been nudging me…repeatedly to get to it. Well I just did, and my jaw dropped.
We have been on the subject of the coming of the Son of man being just like…exactly like the days of Noah and Lot
I found it interesting as I was reading Genesis 7 that the Lord told us exactly WHEN (a month and day) Noah went into the ark. Why pray tell did the Lord tell us that? The Lord (I think) has nudged me on this multiple times now, so here it is:
Gen 7 And Noah was six hundred years old when the flood of waters was upon the earth.
7 And Noah went in, and his sons, and his wife, and his sons’ wives with him, into the ark, because of the waters of the flood. 8 Of clean beasts, and of beasts that are not clean, and of fowls, and of every thing that creeps upon the earth,
9 There went in two and two unto Noah into the ark, the male and the female, as God had commanded Noah.
10 And it came to pass after seven days, that the waters of the flood were upon the earth.
11 In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.
12 And the rain was upon the earth forty days and forty nights.
The second month…the seventeenth day of the month….Gosh, that’s interesting, because when I cross reference that with my Hebrew lunar calendar I get this:
The month of Iyar , 29 days long, with a Gregorian calendar equivalent of what? April-May
Sometime in late April….early May is where the seventeenth day of the second month, the EXACT day that Noah entered the Ark falls. It just so happens that everything I am reading, hearing, seeing seems to indicate that we are approaching something BIG happening beginning the end of this month, all the way through the end of Fall 2009.
People are referring to this summer as the “summer of hell” and “summer of chaos” and it just so happens that Noah entered the ark on the exact day of 17 Iyar which falls in late April, early May?
Nope, I’m not predicting anything! But my eyes are wide open guys….Clues on top of clues on top of clues. In the last days mockers shall come. I don’t have to be warned multiple times to watch and be ready. What are the chances all these “coincidences” line up for this particular time period?
So there it is, I followed the gentle nudgings of the Holy Spirit and that’s what I see. Like I’ve said over and over again, it’s not like we have long to wait in order to find out what happens…..
We have been warned. We have been told to be watching and ready. If nothing happens over the coming weeks except more Americans lose their jobs and apply for food stamps, lose their homes etc by the hundreds of thousands, at least we will have been watching. Be ready….be READY
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Marianne’s note:
Jesus died at Passover, and was back on earth for 40 days after his resurrection…..he left about 10 days before Pentecost, and ascended into heaven…….this would also be about the 17th day of Iyar. The 17th of Iyar starts the Lag B”Omer, the countdown for Shavuot (Pentecost).
So apparently, Jesus ascended (“raptured”) into heaven about the same day Noah was brought (“raptured”) into the ark.
So maybe a “Spring” rapture could happen in this or a year soon to come?
True, that Jesus did not say the day or hour, so how could we say the day?
Because if it follows Passover, the day is not definite, because according to Torah, Passover is held once the Barley harvest is Aviv, or ready. If it is not ready, then there is a month delay.
Modern Jewish calendars are now preset, and do not follow this rule, which can only be followed in Israel, over the barley harvest that is there. For the sake of unity in the Diaspora, the barley observation is not followed, so that Jews around the world can plan for, and celebrate, the Passover at the same time.
However, Jesus would follow the Torah. Therefore, there is a 30 + 40 day extension of time that might be involved with any spring Passover date of any year.
For example, for the year 2009, the “rapture day,” if it is appropriate to call it that, would either be about May 11th, following the scheduled Pesach, or June 9th, following Pesach Sheni.
Like Silvan said, just “be ready.” In Noah’s time, the rain started 7 days after he went into the boat.
In some ways, I would welcome an early date. In other ways, my heart aches for those not saved yet, especially loved ones.
If we humble ourselves and pray, and work for the salvation of loved ones, and even strangers, God the Father will hear us, and may give us mercy and time, to bring in more for the harvest.
[...] moon, and the barley harvest. But once the season is here, can we get a clue as to the day? Click here for [...]
Noah and the Rapture « Heaven Awaits said this on March 18, 2009 at 6:24 pm |
Interesting blog, I’ll try and spread the word.
Noah’s and the end times is such an interesting subject. I study it often to see where we are in God’s time frame.
The Flood removed all the unbelievers of Noah’s day from the earth in judgment. And the believers in Noah’s day, namely, Noah and his family, were left on the ark.
During these last days all believers will be removed before the great tribulation occurs. The same way Noah and his family were removed and given safety.
We see before the flood Enoch the seventh from Adam taken into heaven. This is a picture of the coming of Christ where we will be taken up.
Going in reverse we see a mark placed upon Cain for murdering his brother Abel. In the early days of the tribulation we also see a mark placed upon men. Many others will be killed just as Abel was killed by Cain. This means men who receive Christ during the tribulation will be killed as Abel was slain for bringing an acceptable offering (living Sacrifice) to the Lord.
Next, Cain was banished and left to live east of Eden. During the tribulation the Kings of the east will rise and become strong Rev. 16:12.
Cain’s punishment was seven fold and during the tribulation we see seven years of punishment unleashed upon the Earth.
Going even further we see the serpent appearing in the beginning and he is seen again in the end times. The Lord tells the serpent:
And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.
In the end The woman’ seed Jesus, will return to the Earth to set up His kingdom in Jerusalem. At this time, the serpent will be crushed and defeated.
Then a 1000 year of peace as it was in the garden.
The bible declares the following:
Ecclesiastes 1:9
The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
1:9 There is – There is nothing in the world but a continued and tiresome repetition of the same things. And we see a repeat of all things leading up to the coming of the Lord.
God said his Spirit shall not always strive with man Gen 6:3. Violence was sweeping the land and God chose to destroy the earth due to wickedness and the attempted corruption of human seed by devils.
Comparison:
During Noah’s day Before Christ returns
Wicked imagination Gen. 6:5 Seducing spirits Tim 4:1
Violence on Earth Gen 6:11 Wars and rumors Matt 24:6
Excessive eating Matt 24:38 Excessive eating Matt 24
Drinking Matt 24:38 Drinking Matt 24
Marrying Matt 24:28 Marrying Matt 24
One other interesting fact is the comet Hale Bopp.
From August through late October 1997 in the early morning hours Hale-Bopp was seen in the constellation Argo (Noah’s Ark) from mid August to late December. Argo represents a place of refuge for God’s people in a time of great trouble on Earth. Such was the case during the Great Flood. This is particularly interesting since Hale-Bopp, as seen from Earth, comes from the constellation Pavo which represents Argos (Noah) the shipbuilder of Argo and was last seen in this part of the solar system “in the days of Noah”!
God has always used signs in the heavens to warn. “As it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be in the days of the coming of the Son of Man,” Luke 17:26.
Hi Rev Williams,
I do not quite understand the part about the constellation Argo in 1997. What did that mean then? Is it supposed to return there in the future?
Then you switched to the constellation Pavo. IS that where it is now? How does Pavo = Argo. Are they the same or different?
So in the days of Noah, where is the Hale bopp supposed to be?
And during the tribulation, where is the Hale bopp supposed to be?
blessings
marianne
Sorry for not being more to the point. Hope this helps.
Argo constellation represents a place of refuge for God’s people in a time of great trouble on Earth. Pavo represents Argos (Noah) the shipbuilder of Argos. You could say they are one in the same.
Hale bopp passed through these constellations. Since the last time the comet was seen with the eye was during the days of Noah, and it symbolizes the time we live in, the last days before the end. Coming out of a constellation (agro) that symbolized Noah being provied a place of safety.
Several monthss later it arrived at the constellation Sagittarius, the half-man, half-beast constellation (perhaps a picture of the coming Antichrist). God’s message is simple. I am providing a place of safety from the coming flooding of the enemy.
Hale-Bopp will be in the constellation Argo representing a ship, (the ark).
Hi Rev Williams
Still confused. Are you sure you are talking about Hale bopp?
The current estimate for the return of Hale bopp is circa 4380 CE
http://curious.astro.cornell.edu/question.php?number=733
Comet Hale-Bopp was photographed in the constellation Andromeda by George Shelton, photographer for The Bionetics Corp., at 8:14 p.m. on March 31, 1997
none of this makes sense to me, but I will put a reference for others to look at:
http://philologos.org/bpr/files/sky_signs/ss003.htm
VERY interesting!!
Very well said, Rev. Williams. While I too long for the salvation of unsaved loved ones, the desire to be in the Lord’s presence is greater. Let’s make sure we stay busy in the kingdom, the next person we witness to could be the last person God is waiting on! Maranatha
Hi Marianne.
I hope this clears things up. Jewish oral tradition states when a comet passes through the constellation Orin the world would be destroyed. On May 20, 1997 it entered Orin and existed June 16, 1997. This means it was in the constellation Orin during Shavuot, or Pentecost, on June 11.
In the celestial heavens, there is a constellation which depicts a sailing ship (Argo). Hale-Bopp passed through that area of the sky in mid-August to December 1997!
Hale-Bopp, as seen from earth, spent most of its time in the constellation Pavo. Pavo, previously known as Argos, appears to represent Noah, the builder of the ark of which Argo is a symbol.
A comparison of the paths of the comets reveals some intersting facts.
Hi Rev Williams
So why wasn’t the world destroyed in 1997?
If my memory still serves me right, the reason why YHWH destroyed the earth and all that dwelled therein (except eight humans and 2 of each of all species of the unclean animals and 5 of each of all species of the clean beasts) was because the descended ‘sons of god’ had mingled with the created race of God.
Now these ‘sons of god’ is said to have descended upon Mt. Hermon. To these days we still can find the ancient altars on this mountain which were dedicated to the sacrifices performed unto these ‘sons of god’.
Noteworthy also is the temple of freemasons found there too today.
The vastness of history is too lengthy for me to address in this short forum.
Suffice it to say as Jesus said ‘ As the days of Noah … ‘ So now we at least know for certainty that we are in these last days.
The seeds of the serpent are plenty. Even enough tares to choke to precious bread of the earth.
But to the servants of God the day of The Lord will not take us by surprise. The Hour however knows no one.
Those seeds of the serpent have infiltrated the message of the gospels and of course twisted the pure word of God so much so that discernment is not accessible to the simple minded who trust in the teaching of institutions. And neither is the Truth taught without them mingling it. And for sure those are not shepherds but wolves. And for certain they have no fear of God…. Yet!!
They do not teach to OBEY the loving commandments of God. And so the earth is full of violence.
Maybe when The King Appears we who love and obey Him, ‘we will be like Him’
His reward is with Him and we bear the recompense of their folly in earthen vessels…
for now… until then.
Rev. Williams said “During these last days all believers will be removed before the great tribulation occurs. The same way Noah and his family were removed and given safety.”
That’s a lot to assume when the scripture does not bear that out. I think that we would be better served to prepare our flocks to endure the “tribulation” rather than look forward to an escape from it.
Hi Jerald,
I think the conflict seems to be over definitions. It has been tradition to state that all events in the book of Revelation come under one term: Tribulation.
Jesus said to be prepared to endure the Tribulation, and then is also quoted as saying that we are not appointed to wrath.
I think revelation is divided into 2 parts:
trouble – 7 seals
wrath – the rest of it
Somewhere in this is 7 years. Jacob’s trouble is 3 1/2 years.
I think we are around for the trouble, but not the wrath, which is only for the wicked. Rev Williams may be following the definition that all events (trouble + wrath) in Revelation = “tribulation.”
I’m sorry,but this Hale Bopp comet thing as presented by the Rev Williams, seems to be way off course!
When we start embelishing Scripture with erronous material, all we end up with his confusion and a path that leads away from the main message.
There are enough myths out there already, without adding to them!
Let’s take the story of the Great Flood on face value.
It can stand on it’s own two feet!
Hi Glenn,
There is one passage about a great star that falls, an turns the water bitter. What do you think it might be?
Do you really think Noah’s flood was a myth? What do you think happened instead?
I found this photo of the “ark.” There have been other pictures published as well. It is thought that the boat landed on top of Mt Ararat, and then split during some land movements. There have also been some eye witness testimonies of people who have seen and climbed up on the ark.
http://www.stevequayle.com/Giants/Ancient.Civ_Technol/040426.Noahs.Ark.html
Approximately 36 years ago, i remember well seeing the Ark wedged between 2 mountains…and remember them saying it was in Turkey!
Now, 36 years later, it is found under ground, ice…?? but is visible from the air..
Marianne,
Thanks for your insight. I’m well aware of that stream of thinking but according to Rev. Williams’ context, I do believe that he’s talking about a pre-trib rapture as many in the modern church teach. I’m also aware that the church will not endure the wrath of God that will come at the end of the tribulation. That is a promise that I’m holding on to.
I appreciate your blog and what you’ve had to say but I just couldn’t let this issue pass.
I pray that neither you or Rev. Williams are offended by my remarks.
Even though salvation is a free gift, there is a cost associated with being a disciple of Jesus. Some in this world are even now paying that price with their lives. But the American church has not had to endure that kind of “tribulation” if you will. We have had it pretty easy. And the idea that the church of Jesus Christ will not have to endure the horror of the tribulation of the world by the enemy is not what I see in the Word and it’s not what the church understood until just the last 200 years.
Your post on the flood is excellent and I’m looking forward to reading more of what is here.
Blessings…
As of March 2010, hundreds have been beheaded in Nigeria-they were attacked in the middle of the night..alledgedly due to them being christians!
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100307/wl_africa_afp/nigeriaunrest
I agree with Jerald. The truth is that the pre-trib rapture theory is a fraudulent representation of the biblical doctrine on the first resurrection and it’s seven different and distinct orders, and is built around the second “firstfruit order” known as the “24 Elders”. The scriptures totally refute a single “taking away”, as per any of the so-called “Rapture theoruies, whether pre/post, or mid-trib.
2.Thess.2:1-3, makes it clear that there must “First” come a falling away, and the “Man of sin must be revealed” before the “coming of the Lord, and OUR GATHERING UNTO Him ”
1.Thess.5:1-4 clearly indicates that the “Brethren” are on Earth, right up until “That Day”, (speaking of the Battle of armageddon, or “the Day of the Lord” )
The problem here, is as Marianne has suggested, a conflict over definition. The pre-tribbers equate the seven year tribulation, as being the “Wrath of God”. This is a grave error, that lays the “false foundation” and premise for all their other errors.
Here are a couple of facts to help correct that.
Jesus said in Mt.24, after speaking about the “Abomination that maketh desolate”, (and refering to Daniel) that “Then there shall be GREAT tribulation as never was before” When ?? AFTER the Abomination of desolation has been placed in the Holy Place.
Daniel 9:27 tells us that this happens in the “MIDDLE of the week” ! This fact alone, should “wake up” any serious student of the Bible to the fact that, if they are going to equate the tribulation with the “wrath of God” (which is silly in the first place, as the “Wrath of God” is explicitly proclaimed in both the Old and New Testament, as the “Battle Of Armageddon”) Then such Wrath does not begin until the middle of the Tribulation, and at the exact time of the opening of the “Fifth Seal”
Which brings me to the main premise of the Rapture guru’s, and that is that they erroneously believe the opening of the “First Seal” is the beginning of the Wrath of God. Wrong ! Wrong ! Wrong !
Here is the proof ! If the “first seal” is the “beginning of the “Wrath of God”, then we must conclude that the opening of EVERY SUBSEQUENT Seal, must be a continuation of the “Wrath Of God”. So what do we do with the “Fifth Seal” ? As the result of it’s being “opened”, culminates in the “martyrdom” of God’s Saints, of which the scriptures declare in 1.Thess.5:9, That “We are NOT APOINTED UNTO WRATH ” This all proves that the Tribulation period itself, is not the Wrath of God, but that God’s wrath (i.e. the Trumpets and the Vials culminating in the battle of Armageddon) happens at the end of this period.
This fact of 1.Thess.5:9 cannot be negated, and proves the “rapture guru’s” to be totaly in error.
Lastly, Acts 3:20-21, declares that Christ “MUST REMAIN in HEAVEN until the RESTITUTION of ALL things”, and such restitution does not begin until the BATTLE of Armageddon.
The above speculation about the time-line of the “secret” firstfruit resurrection, is also faulty, as it has to happen on one of two “feast days” of the “Feast of Trumpets”, (which is in the Fall) as is clear from 1.Cor.15:50-53, and Rev.4:1-6.
All this is discussed in my book, ‘None Dare Call It Deception”.
Please point the cursor on my name in the box below, and click to get my website.
Morgan Sorensen
Instead of trying to figure out when Jesus is coming back,why not just be ready and live like every day may be your last,Besides the Bible tells us plainly that He is coming back and No one will know the day and time,and I don’t understand if you believe that ,why do so many try to figure out when and what time,just be PREPARED for it any day… that is like some are just saying OH he is coming next year so this year I can do some fun stuff and get better next year.. be faithfull all the time not just some of it…..
HI Deb
The primary purpose of this site is to present how interesting the Bible is. Sometimes we can learn much from discussion over a single point.
So, my goal is not necessarily to prove a specific issue, but to stimulate people to go to their bibles for scriptures, if they want to debate something. Many people do not even bother to open their bibles, and leave all the thinking to their pastors.
Here, I want them to think for themselves, because the Word of God and knowledge of it, is a weapon against our enemy, who is Satan. I want people to wake up to the scritpures, and use them more effectively.
I see this all the time, but now I ask just ONE question; will someone be so kind as to point to me WHERE O WHERE IN THE BOOK OF REVELATION that John speaks of SEVEN
years???? Thank you.
Do you remember the song ‘California dreaming’? Do you remember the one sentence ‘I felt down on my knees’ ? The lyrics of the song goes on to say ‘and I pretend to pray.’ Well we certainly can change that to ‘I began to pray’.
Well anyway the reason I ask you this is because The Lord even in the middle of the night wakes me up with just this one sentence ‘I felt down on my knees.’
Abigail
Hi Abigail
THere is no 7 years in the Book of Revelation. Only 3 1/2 period of time is mentioned, although there are other small time periods like 5 months mentioned during the wrath.
The 7 years comes from Daniel’s last week of the 70 weeks.
People extrapolate that to include the entire book of Revelation, with all the events that occur.
Gonna put my 2 cents worth in. With all due respect, Rev. Williams, I don’t think Noah on the Ark is a picture of the rapture. But there WAS a picture of the rapture there. It needs to be known that Enoch was alive while Noah lived. And Enoch was taken off the earth just before the Flood. Noah had to endure that judgment on earth, (safe in the Ark.) So Enoch was the example of a catching up of saints to miss wrath. Noah was the example of keeping a people safe DURING wrath.
Look, each end of a Bible age has a harvest. The Flood was the end of an age and had harvests. Likewise, soon the 70th week of Daniel is going to start. That means an age will have passed, and a new age is begun. When that former age passed, Bible history shows us there would have been a harvest. Again, some will be taken up, and others will have to endure the wrath, some safe in Petra. This, in agreement with Rev. Williams’ comments from Ecles. of history repeating itself.
There has for too long been confusion of including the destinies of Christians and Israelis as the same. Much of where the Scriptures are speaking of the Bride, are not meant for the Israelis, and vice-versa. The two have DIFFERENT DESTINIES! (Yes, some Israelis will have converted before the end of that age and will be part of the Bride.)
The Bride will be called up to the Heavenlies with Jesus to the wedding banquet, and will have Heavenly bodies. The remaining Israelis will live on in earthly bodies thru the Tribulation and the millenium. The Israelis are NOT the Bride, but will remain the earthly chosen ones.
And I do not believe I am giving false hope to a pre-trib rapture, that many will falter. I believe we need to be encouraged with the truth, wherever it stands by evidence.DavWms
PS: I might say, if you do not see that the Jews and Christians have different destinies, you will not be able to correctly divide the Word. If you can see they do, then if you go back and read everything pertaining to the end of days, you will likely have many eureka moments as you see clarity in the meaning of many verses. DavWms
David,
The Israel of God, the Holy Israel of God belongs to God. The seed of promise, the seed of righteousness belongs to God. There is neither jew or gentile with God. To whom did God say you are my wife?
Anyways on another subject here is a video for you to consider.
http://video.google.com/googleplayer.swf?docId=-750107269338052182&hl=en
Yes, Abigail, I am aware of those Scriptures. It is true that IN CHRIST, there is no Jew or gentile. But as I said, Jews and the Bride of Christ have different destinies in the overall picture, don’t they? Generally, the Jews have chosen not to be the Bride.
I look at it all like there is a perenthisis in God’s dealing with His Jews. In that perenthesis, He is forming the Bride, His body. When that is complete, a new era will begin, the 70th week of Daniel, where God specifically deals again with the Jews. DavWms
I think Deb hit the nail right on the head with her comment. I understand what David is trying to say. There are parts of Revelation that are asynchronous and parts that occur outside of time. I do believe that Revelation allows for a 7 year period of trouble. Not going to get into terms here. Could be more, could be less but at least 3 1/2 years the Bible singles out as the worst the world has ever or will ever see. I believe like some others that chapture 4 is a picture of the rapture. I’ve always had some thoughts on other portions of the book that relate to Davids comments. In chapter 7 of Revelation, we see the 144,000 Jewish evangelists on the earth. Later in that same chapter we see the Bride of Christ, saved from all nations. In chapter 14 we see the 144,000 in heaven, singing a song before the throne. I think it is without dispute that they experienced a rapture specific to them. During their time on earth the 144,000 Jews, the 2 witnesses and the Gospel angel are responsible for multitudes being won to Christ. Likely more people than are in the Bride. When the man of sin stands in the temple and declares himself God, most Jews will reject him, flee to Petra, etc. This will signal the aforementione 3.5 year great tribulation/wrath. My thought is this, since the Bride is already in heaven and marriage supper of the Lamb has already occured, what becomes of the multitudes saved during the tribulation or the wrath, as well as the Jews who come to Christ during this time as well as those saved during the millenium? (By the way, though our destinies may be different, there is still only one WAY and that is through Christ. The Jews must be saved to be right with God). My thought is this, you have two groups of people when this is all said and done: Those who are in the Bride of Christ in their glorified bodies and those saved during the tribulation/wrath and the Jews. Both immortal, both still human, one glorified, one not. The Bible speaks of people continuing to build houses and such. We, the Church/Bride, will already have our dwelling place in New Jerusalem. So these must be ontologically different. I could be way off. We’ll have to wait and see. But we can surmise from Scripture that the Bride is only the Church; the church began on the day of Pentecost and will end with the rapture. So anyone on either side of the divide (Noah, Abraham, David etc before and tribulation/wrath Saints and the nation of Israel after) constitutes another group. If there is a delineation for the Bride, it stands to reason that she alone will be glorified. The rest will be immortal, sinless humans, but otherwise no different than those who live on earth now.
Hi Amardo,
DO you think the Bride represents the entire church, or a remnant within the church? If he came for the entire church, it would first have to “be without spot or wrinkle.” Possibly, if the church went through the tribulation, it would come out purified.
Isn’t it by faith that you are saved? Let us clear some misunderstanding here. Jesus is in charge of the atonement. The 144,000 sealed with the seal of the living God are the servants ‘the prophets’ of God, and those are their number. The numberless multitude are the saints. And those are not numbered.
The true Israel of God are those who like Abraham have left all (land, wives, husbands, children etc.) because they believe and they will have Eternal Life.
The tribe of Dan and Euphraim are excluded because of their idolatries.
You must be born again from God and not from women and those who are truly born again are no longer jew, gentile, chinese etc. because they have forsaken the world believing of a better place.
The bride of Christ are those baptized in water, in fire, in the death of Jesus, in the Holy Spirit, and in the resurrection.
Confusion seems to run rampant. O lord I pray anchor your assembly!
Abigail, I really can’t answer your questions without knowing where you are coming from. Meaning, do you think the Jews have been done away with forever for refusing the Savior, and that God will only deal with born-again Christians from that time on? This is sometimes called, the “replacement theory.”
I did show that I agree that IN CHRIST, there is no Jew or gentile. But outside of Christ, the people remain Jews and gentiles from my point of view. I also note that those living in the millenium will be in human only bodies, tho with good health and long lives. It is noted there that if a person dies at a hundred (?)years in that era, he will be considered to have died as a baby. So that eliminates immortal bodies for them, at least until after the millenium. And yes, the Bride will come down to dwell on or in new Jerusalem during the millenium.
BTW, your catching the “numbered and unnumerable is good,” thanx. DavWms
Abigail, Gal. 3:27-29 explains it is the ones IN CHRIST who are neither male or female, Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, all are one in Christ, and those are Abraham’s offspring. But like Jesus told the religious leaders, they are not Abraham’s offspring, but sons of the devil. DavWms
go and tell the king that the sky is falling in
but it’s not.
seems like you are all pretty desperate for life to be over- lest you give in to reality and realise that what will follow is unkown and uncertain.
z
ok…the sky is not falling
Iran has not threatened the USA or ISrael
Russia is not testing nuclear weapons, and has not aligned with Venezuela and Cuba for a possible attack on the USA.
Israel is happy and has never been attacked by the terrorists in Gaza.
Osama bin laden’s group has given up, and wants peace.
the world is not suffering from economic collapse.
compared to when shell shock victims in england relapsed into madness on hearing the artillery hitting the trenches in france.
or when hitler was rampaging accross europe. or the great depression when people starved. or the hight of the cold war when nuclear war between world powers looked like it might really happen- as opposed to now when it is relatively unlikely.
we’re doing alright.
us humans will die off sometime, as all species eventually do.
p.s. the god of the bible obviously doesn’t exist in reality. this is not even a point worth arguing. maybe something created us, it certainly didn’t write us a book.
God bless you, zarathustra
may you find the truth and give up on this nonsense- marianne
Z
we all have different things that give us joy. Mine is my faith in Jesus. Yours is philosophy.
yours is hoping that life will end.
mine is enjoying it while it lasts.
z
but what do you think will happen when you die? will you just rot away, and that is it? Suppose you are wrong? Just suppose…? You want me to consider that I am wrong. So what if it is not me, but you?
If I am wrong, then I lose nothing by believing this. If you are wrong, what will happen to you?
my body will rot, if some kind of spiritual element remains (which seems incredibly unlikely but hey- why not) then i will experience whatever happens after death.
the mystery of death has nothing to do with “heaven” and “hell”, these are human constructions limited by the human imagination.
hellfire and damnation only came into fashion in the middle ages, most of the imagery is taken from dante’s inferno and not from the bible. the emphasis on hell was (and is) used to scare people into submitting to religion.
z
Hell is mentioned 54 times in the bible, which pre-dates the middle ages.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/search/translationResults.cfm?Criteria=hell&t=KJV
Just a note,
First of all, the Jews never believed in Hell and it doesn’t appear in the Torah. The word they use is Sheol which is just a grave. The early Christians who inherited the concept of Hell from the Romans (as well as SUNday worship etc.), replaced the word grave with Hell in about half the time in the OT and used it profusely in the NT even though the Jewish writers/apostles never used the term since it was not in their belief system.
It is one of the paganistic elements in the whore of Babylon church that will be cleansed when Christ returns. Do you really believe Jesus will go to the temple on Sunday when he returns? If you do you will be in big trouble in the tribulation. And don’t think you will get a free ride around it by a rapture. God tests his people thru tribulation not by giving them a free pass. The old testament is full of tribulations (Job, Jacob etc,) and we will be there thru the final one – but believers will be protected until the real rapture – as Jesus returns to fight the battle of Armageddon. Then we will be changed and return to earth after the battle is over. (10 days?)
If I’m right, we will all have to reject the mark of the beast, if we can figure out what it truly is. This will be the sign (mark) of our true faith as believers in Jesus and keepers of his commandments.
So don’t expect a free pass. You must get ready for it. I pray that you will be.
of course, but the imagery associated with it in the modern christian mind is pure dante
Z
There is no such thing as ‘the mystery of death’. That is a false concept as all concepts are false.
And concepts are false because they are a fabrication of an intellect grasping at nothing.
Whether ancient or modern views of concepts it matters not. Time does not make a thing which is false better, Fallacy is fallacy.
But life does hold a mystery!! Which without the knowledge of God is kept hidden.
Jesus sums it this way,: I came that you might have life and Life more abundantly”, implying that one is dead without Him. Not later, but before Him.
Or again Jesus says ‘ Let the dead bury their dead and come and follow me.’
Now you see that the mystery is in ‘life’ not in death.
Without Him there is no life!
You may be disillusioned in thinking that you are living but in reality you are dead.
Now that is not a concept but the ‘Truth’
I pray to meant all In heaven I pray for none to be left.
I know I might be signing my death sentence here and bring people at me big time.
We need to pray for each other so we all may have a closer walk with thee.
We aren’t only to pray for are brothers and sisters but also for the nonbelievers as well.
We all need Christ we all fall short of his glare.
As a person we can due little, through Christ we can move a mountain.
Are words are weak his is strong
Marianne;
It must be video day. A video for this subject:
Matthew 24:37-39
Dutch Creationist: Johan Hubers, Schagen Netherlands
I hope these videos are blessing you. I got blessed off of them.
Kittii
Hi Kitti
great video…!
Hi Marianne,
I couldn’t help but notice that someone mentioned that there was no Seven Year End-Time mentioned in Revelation, whereas Daniel did.
I beg to differ on that notion.
Rev.11:2 …and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty [and] two months.
3. And I will give [power] unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred [and] threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
I don’t know about the Americans, but we have been taught in arithmetic, …that AND means ADD.
So if we have 42 Months AND 1,260 Days, that gives us a total of SEVEN Years, don’t you agree?
I thought I would like to add some very interesting observation that was brought to my attention.
The Date of the Unification of Jerusalem, in the LOCAL time was June the 7th, 1967. The Americans (Home to the UN), call it as 6/7/67. [We in Australia have DD/MM/YYYY.]
The DATE of 6/7/67 has actually got Prophetic significance, if you believe in Creation Week. Man was made on the 6th day, and GOD “Rested” from His Creating on the 7th day.
Before we GO to our Promised Land [Heaven], just like the Israelites, had to Circumnavigate Jericho ONCE a DAY for the 6-days, but on GOD’S Day, they Circumnavigated 7x on that 7th Day.
Now I find this the interesting bit; As I find that we were told to MEASURE the TEMPLE (47 years)[Rev.11:1,2], AFTER the time of the fulfillment of GENTILE time [Luke 21:24], 1967 till 2014, being the very END, we see the 9/11 EVENT which is recorded in Revelation Chapter 18, is 13 years BEFORE the END.
NOT Only is it Significant, …WHEN 9/11 Event occurred, it was 9/12/2001. …Now you may be wondering, what is all the fuss about? As you know, the Hebrew NEW YEAR [Trumpets] date on the Gregorian Calendar is on a different day each year, but EXACTLY Six years to the Day, of the 6th anniversary of 9/11, we have NEW Year on the Hebrew Calendar, to START the COUNTDOWN of the LAST 7 years!
Thus we have 9/11 + 6/7 [13yrs], not only that, the American “Great Seal” has an eagle with 13 Arrows, 13 Olive Branches, 13etc. Signifying the 13 States at the time. The UN is depicted in Revelation 13 when it begins its rule!
Hi again Marianne,
I made a mistake with the time the 9/11 incident occurred and the Jerusalem time. After checking the internet time zone calculator, it was not quite sunset at Jerusalem [5:28pm] …as it was 10:28am. New York local time when the Twin Towers were demolished, according to the report posted on the Internet, so the day had not changed to the 12th of September.
|_________________40yrs______________________|_3.5y_|_3.5y|End
|___Measure_Altar_to_end_of_Temple_worship___|[30AD-70AD]
|1967__________________________2001________2007___2011__2014
9/11___13years till End____|
|__Measure_Temple_in Building_(46y)_-47th year in service_|
…John 2:20 – for Temple building duration
…Rev.11:1,2 for TEMPLE measurement from Time given to Gentiles
…Luke 21:24 “Gentile Times” fulfillment [Jerusalem not trodden by Gentiles.]
I am Sorry, but the submitted time lines are not the same once I submit them!
The second line should end at the beginning of the first lot of 3.5y, the Third line is correct, but the Fourth line should START under the year 2001, and finish at the year 2014.
The fifth line starts correctly, but the END should terminate at the year 2014.
Olaf,
the text wraps around. I will send you something, and you tell me if this is what you want…..also, what does 30-40 AD have to do with now?
Thank you Marianne,
to answer the question with regards to 30-40 AD, if you look closely, I wrote [30-70AD], which is a period of 40 years.
If you are a little perplexed with the fact that I quoted a time period from the Crucifixion and the Destruction of the TEMPLE in 70AD, then it will require a better explanation on my part, as I admit that I often assume that the reader knows of the other factors in this mysterious puzzle.
Jesus stated: Matt.24:2. And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.
…He was referring to the TEMPLE.
The Question was asked Matt.24:3. And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what [shall be] the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?
…(1) When will these things BE. [END of the Temple]
(2) Sign of Jesus’ Coming & END of the World.
On this occasion, it was ONLY Luke who answered the (2) SIGN.
Luke 21:24. And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
…SIGN = Jerusalem Trodden down by Gentiles UNTIL the Fulfillment of GENTILE Time.
As we know from HISTORY, the (1)”WHEN will these things BE” question is answered, but the (2) “Sign of Jesus’ Coming & END of the World.” is STILL unanswered!
We must look a little further, and find the hidden clue that unlocks it. Seeing that it was a DOUBLE – Barreled question, we can assume that it has been answered if we look at a COMMON denominator. The following is that Common to BOTH.
Luke 21:32. Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.
…The words “THIS GENERATION” who EXPERIENCE all the happenings, will “NOT pass away till ALL be fulfilled.”
As you can appreciate, those who experienced the period from the pronouncement of that double barreled prophecy [just previous to Jesus' crucifixion] till the time that the Temple was destroyed, have NOT lived long enough to see the FULFILLMENT of ALL [End of the World].
Seeing that was the case, we MUST assume that the TEMPLE destruction, is NOT synonymous with the END of TIME!
We therefore have to place these TWO parts of the Prophecy in TWO distinct TIME SLOTS.
Today, the Prophecy of the TEMPLE Destruction is NO LONGER prophecy, but HISTORY!
It is in Luke 21:24, as I quoted earlier, that AFTER the Fulfillment of GENTILE TIMES, that the LAST “Generation will NOT PASS till ALL be fulfilled”. [e.g. (2)-(Sign & End of the World)]
If we know from the “PAST” that it took 40 years for the Generation NOT to pass away, then, the PERIOD after the SIGN till the END of the World would HAVE to be ABOUT the same period length of TIME.
John was told in Rev.11:1. And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, Rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.
2. But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles:
…Measure (1) Temple. (2) Altar. (3) [Period] of Temple Worship.
(1) Temple took 46 years in Building – in use on 47th year.
(2) Altar = Jesus Crucifixion [Passover Lamb] on Altar. [AD 30]
(3) Temple was WORSHIPED in Till it was DESTROYED. [AD 70]
John 2:20. Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?
…As you well know, John was the one who penned Revelation.
From the above explanation, I hope it has cleared up the question why the TWO HALVES of the Prophecy that predicted TWO distinctly DIFFERENT events, has TIME PERIODS in COMMON.
I shall try again to give the time lines.
|1967_________________________________2007___2011___2014
|___________________40y_________________|_3.5y_|_3.5y_|
(2)Measure those worshiping
|__________Altar to Destruction_________|
(1)
|__________Temple Measurement_47y_____________________|
……………………….2001__6y__2007_____7y_____|
6/7/67……………………|___6____________7______|
Jericho – 6x on each (man’s) week day + 7x on God’s Day.
hi Olaf,
This would somewhat parallel what Silvan said, above in the post.
Noah was 6-00 years old when the flood waters started
after 7 days the flood was all over the earth
rain was for 40 days.
But since 2001 happened in America, not Israel, I do not see why 2001 would start the 7 years, although it was a dramatic event. It is already 2009, and nothing significant has occurred yet.
Also, like I said above, Jesus would follow the Torah. Therefore, there is a 30 + 40 day extension of time that might be involved with any spring Passover date of any year. Passover, and the following Shavuot has to pass before the 3 1/2 month gap before the fall feasts.
This would mean up to 70 years before a tribulation, if people are not ready.
Spring of Israel (1948) + 70 = 2018 – 7 = 2011 latest start time
Summer of Israel (1967) + 70 = 2037 – 7 = 2030 latest start time
I have looked for what ‘Silvan ‘ has said in the above post and …
I can’t find it.
hi abigail
Silvan is the author of this post.
Silly?
I did not see that.
But I will tell you what I do see.
When the Lord says ‘Watch and pray’ …
He is not referring to the blind eyes of the body.
There is ‘another sight’ that must be given, by God,
to man…
‘because they say they can see… they do not know that they are blind.’
Hear, ye deaf; and look, ye blind, that ye may see.
Mat 6:22
The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.
Same is true with the ear.
And that is why the scriptures says
Let him who has AN ear … hear.
Hi again Marianne,
I think we are following on two different paths in this discussion.
The Measurement John was to make, was from Jesus’ “Sign” of 6/7/67 (Jerusalem united), with a MAXIMUM period being LESS than a Generation, …which is the TEMPLE Measurement of 47 YEARS. [1967 + 47 = 2014]…”Measure the Temple” Rev.11:1
You say that the TWIN TOWERS were in the USA! You are EXACTLY right! We are DEALING with this Earth, not the MOON or one of the other planets. The Resurrection will occur not ONLY in Israel, but EVERYWHERE or ANYWHERE on Earth.
What is being missed in this fact about the 9/11 event, is that it HAPPENED inside the END TIMES last Generation! 1967-2014
It is also dealt with in Revelation …in Chapter 18.
Everything, apart from the time of 1,000 years following the FIRST resurrection and beyond, is dealt with in Revelation chapter 4 onwards, and is within this period of 47 years.
Now this 47 years is broken up into smaller periods, as if Jesus was ZOOMING in on that 47 years, by telling us to see the 47 years as 40 years, just like the period in which the Temple was CONTINUING to be worshiped in by those who refuse to recognize that it was made REDUNDANT, for the TEMPLE was just an EXAMPLE of Jesus.
After that 40 years, there is 3.5 years PLUS 3.5 years. [= 47]
These Jews were just like those who now believe in a Temple in HEAVEN, today. That is disregarding Jesus’ Sacrifice for us!
Rev.21:22. And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.
Until we realize this fact, we have NOT grasped the whole meaning of the PLAN of Salvation.
The Israelites who CONTINUED with the OLD Covenant after the NEW Covenant superseded it, did so, because they did not accept the Divinity of Jesus! We as Christians are no different if we believe in a continuation of the OLD Covenant rituals being played out in the Heavens.
What I must point out here, before you jump to conclusions on my statements; These CEREMONIAL events are not to continue, where it involves the slaughter of animals for the payment of our sins, but the TIMING of all these Ceremonies have a job to fulfill in pointing to a day in the very near future, with such as the LATTER “Rain”, as mentioned in Joel 2:23. Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in the LORD your God: for he hath given you the former rain moderately, and he will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain in the first [month].
28. And it shall come to pass afterward, [that] I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:
29. And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.
What I am saying that the Morning and evening sacrifices are done away with, and Passover has been REPLACED with the YEARLY foot washing and taking of the Bread and Wine in REMEMBRANCE of Calvary.
Getting back to this LAST 47 years, the FIRSTFRUITS will have to wait only for 1,335 days INTO the LAST Seven Jewish Calendar years [from 12th Sept. 2007] to be “Delivered” or redeemed. Seeing the day of deliverance is 9th of May 2011, it so happens to coincide with ISRAEL Independence day! The FIRSTFRUITS are the 144,000 and as if Jesus could foresee the division of the Bible into Chapters and verses some 300 odd years ago, the Dan.12:12 is hinting on this number – (12×12=144)
12. Blessed [is] he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.
This Collective group is the “WOMAN” that City “TRODDEN DOWN” for the first 42 months [Rev.11:2]2. But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the HOLY CITY shall they tread under foot forty [and] two months.
She also will live in heaven during the Tribulation, for the “Beast” has seen her go Rev.13:6. And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and THEM THAT DWELL IN HEAVEN.
If the “Beast” was blaspheming the ANGELS, it would have stated so.
Rev.126. And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place PREPARED OF GOD, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred [and] threescore days.
Here we have an expression that JOHN has used before in his EPISTLE. John 14:2. In my Father’s house are many mansions: if [it were] not [so], I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, [there] ye may be also.
4. And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.
Notice this LAST verse is verse 4 [John 14:4] hint 14:4 -(144)]
I had better stop, before I get “Carried away” on this subject.
Hi Olaf
What I meant was this: You have 2007 as the beginning of the tribulation. It is now 2009, so the tribulation should be almost over now. Nothing significant has happened yet. Therefore, 2007 was not the start of the tribulation, unless this is an uneventful, boring tribulation.
Marianne,
I did not use the word TRIBULATION in connection with the START of the 7 Years. It is the FIRST 3.5 years that the “Holy City”, or New Jerusalem are downtrodden. As I pointed out, the Holy City is the BRIDE, This “Woman” / Firstfruits / Chosen Ones [as opposed the Numberless Remnant of her SEED who go through Tribulation].
Please take note that the TRIBULATION …ENDS at the Resurrection, but only lasts for ~ 3.25 years. The TRIBULATION Time PERIOD is also covered by Daniel, just like the START of the 7 year period in which there are 1,335 days of waiting for that BRIDE / 5 – Wise Virgins / 144,000 / Elect / Chosen ones.
The TRIBULATION has been pointed out to you previously, which goes for a Period of 2,300 Evenings and Mornings, and as was pointed out, this length of time spans 1,150 days, so is roughly 3.25 years.
Dan.8:12. And an host was given [him] against the daily [sacrifice] by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practiced, and prospered.
13. Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain [saint] which spake, How long [shall be] the vision [concerning] the daily [sacrifice], and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?
14. And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.
…Sanctuary = SAINT and Cleansed = Justified – Check with the Concordance. There is NO Sanctuary to be CLEANSED in the END.
…Here we see the “HOST” was given him [the "Beast"] against the DAILY [TIME ...Something that continues] (Sacrifice – not in original) Jesus is the one who says that TIME is finished!
Rev.10:7. But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.
Just like the last words on the Cross, He says “It is Finished” and Jesus Dies, just like at the end of the World, the UNREPENTANT sinners will die the first death.
So as the END of TRIBULATION terminates at the END of the World, we must count BACK 1,150 days to its beginning. That will be the time when the “Mark” is issued by the “Beast”.
|_1,335 days Waiting for Jesus_|__|_Tribulation till the End_|
The Holy City Down Trodden __________Host Down Trodden/killed
1,335 days + 1,150 days = 2,485 days.
…2 lots of 1,260 days = 2,520 days.
We therefore see a gap of 35 days in which the “FOOLISH” Virgins realize that they did not have enough oil in their “lamps”, and miss the “Wedding Breakfast”. At the END, Jesus will again return and collect the Resurrected and those who are still alive after the Tribulation. This is described in Luke 12:35. Let your loins be girded about, and [your] lights burning;
36. And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately.
…It is NOW that we need to find out as much as we can, so we can have the “Good Oil” [Information] on the returns of Christ, so we can share with those who are eager to know the facts and in turn share it with others, just like the parable of the TALENTS. We can choose to say it is too difficult – like the person who had just one TALENT given to him for safe-keeping, and do nothing about it, but we miss out on heaven in so doing.
Matt.25:30. And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
31. When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
It is only those who EAGERLY want to be with the LORD, who will be granted their wish and miss out on Tribulation and death.
Luke 14:16. Then said he unto him, A certain man made a great supper, and bade many:
17. And sent his servant at supper time to say to them that were bidden, Come; for all things are now ready.
18. And they all with one [consent] began to make excuse. The first said unto him, I have bought a piece of ground, and I must needs go and see it: I pray thee have me excused.
19. And another said, I have bought five yoke of oxen, and I go to prove them: I pray thee have me excused.
20. And another said, I have married a wife, and therefore I cannot come.
21. So that servant came, and showed his lord these things. Then the master of the house being angry said to his servant, Go out quickly into the streets and lanes of the city, and bring in hither the poor, and the maimed, and the halt, and the blind.
22. And the servant said, Lord, it is done as thou hast commanded, and yet there is room.
23. And the lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and hedges, and compel [them] to come in, that my house may be filled.
24. For I say unto you, That none of those men which were bidden shall taste of my supper.
…As we see in this parable, it was those “Professing” Christians who were more interested in the attractions of the “World” to just spend a few hours of their time to see what the Bible really says, and realize that the WHOLE agenda is mapped out for us to KNOW how CLOSE we are to our deliverance!
Olaf,
I think you are spending way too much time with too many numbers. Many people thought 2007 would be significant because it was 40 years or an assumed “generation” from the time of the unification of Israel and Jerusalem.
Didn’t happen. Its too soon. The world need another 20 years or so to get to the point to where the prophesies can be fulfilled. You can’t rush it. There is one more pope before the tribulation and Benedict is still going strong. The Christian churches must come together into a unified church under the pope. The war of Gog must happen. More natural disasters must occur. Disease must run rampant.
Populations and hunger must increase.
Oil must start to run out.
The seven seals must be opened etc.
Were almost there but not quite.
You want a date? How about 2000 years from the time Christ left? Sometime around 2033. The 7 years should start on the feast of trumpets in 2026 and end the same day in 2033 when Christ returns on his birthday.
Not mathematical but logical. And simple.
That’s my guess and I’m sticking to it.
Great Logic JG! God DOES like big round numbers.
There still remains debate over the 33AD. Some say 33AD, others 31AD, others 30AD, and still others 29AD.
Based on the assumption of Jesus being 30yo at the onset of his public ministry, coupled with the star research assumptions of 3 to 4BC being Jesus’ birth…
—-> These favor something closer to 30AD, thus adding 2000yrs would be a 7yr Tribulation between 2023AD to 2030AD.
===================================================
Now there is a delimma concerning a separate, but mildly related issue to the above mentioned 2000yrs. Arch Bishop Usher has the best reputation of historical biblical chronology experts and he concluded that Creation occurred in 4004BC. If one adds 6000yrs(6days), then we find ourselves in approximately the year 1996AD. So here we are now in 2012, 16yrs into the great 1000yr millineal reign of Jesus on Earth, yet we cannot be because wars still continue… So the question regarding the ‘day is as a 1000yrs’ application comes under the microscope. I believe part of the answer is found in Satan being let out of prison for a short duration after the end of the 1000 years of peace. That extra addendum implies a slightly larger time measuring dynamic than exactly 7000 years. Personally, I believe this ‘big picture timeline’ to be exactly 7056 years (84squared, i.e. 84x84yrs), for multiple reasons.
The 70th week started on Sept 29, 2008 feast of trumpets when the dow dropped 777 points. Jesus already fulfilled the first 3 1/2 years and antichrist gets the last 3 1/2. The 1290 days of Daneil 12 takes you to the “baptism” of the antichrist on April 11, 2012 and the 1335 days of Daniel 12 takes you to pentecost 2012 (may 26,27) when the church is raptured. Just as Jesus had a 3 year actual ministry from 30 ad passover to 33 ad passover, antichrist’s 3 year and thus the great tribulation starts on feast of trumpets sept 17, 2012. There is 1100 days until the day of atonement sept 23, 2015 just as Antiochus Epiphanes profaned the temple for 1100 days in 168-165bc. Christ returns on Feast of Trumpets 2015 (sept 14th) and the the devil is locked up by Day of Atonement 2015 when the millenial reign starts. This is all laid out in my blog http://www.jubilee144.blogspot.com
Will, I checked your blog but I couldn’t figure out a few things. Like why the stock market can trigger the prophecy of Daniel, or what transits of Venus have to do with anything. Venus never appears in the bible nor do transits of either inner planets. And how does Jesus fulfill the first half of the tribulation and if it’s already finished then we are in the second half now – yes?
Also Christ’s ministry was 3-1/2 years, not 3. He would have started on his 30th birthday which was on the feast of trumpets, not Passover. He will return on his birthday, the same day the False Prophet comes to power. (The term “Antichrist” is a misnomer). That much you’ve got right.
If the second coming is in 2015, that is 6 years away, so we are a year into the 7 year tribulation period which means the False Prophet is now in power. But there is no peace plan in Israel and none of the seals have been opened yet.
You’ve thrown around a lot of times and dates but they seem to come out of your imagination. How about some more details to prove what you are saying here. If the beast is already here we want to know who he is. Any ideas?
Well this series is about ‘THE UNIVERSAL FLOOD’.
Thought it may interest you.
Whil this lecture sounds very scientific and could probably convince the average person that what he is saying is true, He makes a lot of assumptions that have no basis in fact and simply lies about certain other things while ignoring some basic truths. I’m sorry but there is no way to explain millions of years of geology in a single year long event. His theory is full of holes and the rest is a pack of lies. He is not a scientist, he is a man with an agenda and twisting the truth to make it fit.
That’s pretty common around here.
Excuse me but Prof. Walter Veith is a scientist.
If you did not watch the series then please refrain from commenting.
And if you did then you must be an evolutionist to make such comments.
I watched all 6 episodes carefully. His science is flawed and biased. I have studied geology or 32 years. I know enough to recognize bad science when I see it.
Take some classes in a real school. Learn some facts. Don’t believe everything you see on line at face value.
That’s all I’m saying.
james
I do not believe everything science says at face value either, just to balance things out here.
Science has NEVER proved that anything took millions of years…..!!!
yet people blindly go along with that claim.
science does not have the tools to measure time back that far. they just make up times to fit their theories.
In estimating “time,” geologists do not have a proper standard curve, so the time data is not valid.
I sure hope the rapture doesn’t occur like this poor cow …
abigail
I now have motivation to lose weight. I don’t want to look like that going up!
LOL HAhahahahahaha yes … especially if someone is filming
But all jokes aside … there has been an increase in UFO sighting that boggles
the mind … The book of Joel is in the forefront of my thoughts.
Joe 2:9 They shall run to and fro in the city; they shall run upon the wall, they shall climb up upon the houses; they shall enter in at the windows like a thief.
Incredible!!
with such a dramatic thing as UFO abductions, you’d think the bible would have said something…..prophetic….
like…..
I lift up mine eyes unto the skies, to whence goes my cow……….
or….
the euphrates opens, and out comes flying baskets of iron into the earth to torment mankind 42 years.
The Scriptures does speak of these …
A day of darkness and of gloominess, a day of clouds and of thick darkness, as the morning spread upon the mountains: a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after it, [even] to the years of many generations.
Like the noise of chariots on the tops of mountains shall they leap, like the noise of a flame of fire that devoureth the stubble, as a strong people set in battle array.
Before their face the people shall be much pained: all faces shall gather blackness.
Neither shall one thrust another; they shall walk every one in his path: and [when] they fall upon the sword, they shall not be wounded
The earth shall quake before them; the heavens shall tremble: the sun and the moon shall be dark, and the stars shall withdraw their shining:
How do the beasts groan! the herds of cattle are perplexed, because they have no pasture; yea, the flocks of sheep are made desolate
The beasts of the field cry also unto thee
Do you not see the book of Joel describing the day of The Lord?
Alas for the day! for the day of the LORD [is] at hand, and as a destruction from the Almighty shall it come.
I know your hatred for Islam …
but not the entire book of the bible speaks of them actually I don’t think they are mentioned at all in the book of Joel.
And what do you mean by 42 years?
you think Joel was referring to an alien invasion? Maybe so…
I was just making up examples.
Well … this army seems dangerous …
they shall not be wounded …
‘people’ are pained …
there has ‘never’ been the like …
they just do not sound human to me …
the heavens tremble …
the earth quake …
now if he were describing a weapon only I would say yes … maybe human?
but he is describing something called ‘ a great people’ … unlike anything before or after for many generations…
Yes I think the prophet is describing an alien invasion and a scary, powerful, one at that.
When I was 21 yrs. old the Lord showed me that specific army.
They is also spoken of in the book of revelation.
Rev 9:9 And they had breastplates, as it were breastplates of iron; and the sound of their wings [was] as the sound of chariots of many horses running to battle
Abigail
The Joel prophecy sounds like a good idea for a post.
I am sorry I did not see this till now …
Yes I think the prophecy of Joel would be a great idea for a post.
Will you do it?
working on it now….i would like to add some indian observations along with joel but not sure how that would mesh together yet. both discuss “aliens”
You are too funny! “to whence goes my cow”
Hi
I cannot help but listening in about aliens.. I truly never really thought about it until tonight.. I’ll share a dream with you and all… I had this dream from 4 years ago.. It is still fresh in my mind and in heart.
Dream :
I was walking down the street in the line between city and country… and I noticed how people riled up and shouting and gathering weapons of ANYTHING.. like pitchforks, guns, and much more… and heading somewhere.. which I had no idea. Then I kept on walking aware of surroundings… moving closer to vet place or some place that deal with animals. I saw 4 men dragged and carried one beautiful and so silky and well muscled black stallion that looks like dead. I stayed back.. watching it all folding before me.. waiting patiently for those men to leave… which they did rushed out almost like if their tails are on fire.. I looked around to make sure there is no one else… then walk closer and carefully toward the horse.. Nearly upon him.. I was startled at his sudden movement and transformation… He got up on its feet and rushing toward me turning into angel…No shirt…. wings in black.. black boots, black leather pants..
He reached and grabbed my hand at the same time telepathy of his communication telling me to run with him.. So I just followed.. still holding his hand… out of building.. toward yet rather passing what I saw at a glance for details in few seconds that astonished me yet not surprised either… There was riot going on at the mountain with all people around on the ground.. shouting and shaking weapons and fists into air.. I look up what lays above mountain is a huge sized spaceship which looks a lot like alien…
An angel male sent me a word in telepathy was ” Do not worry about it. You will be okay..” Then I looked cross to see where he is going to take me to… and great shock to me was to see how rapidly the land can transformed right before my very eyes… into other place that I cannot place.. all I see was oh so beautiful green pastures… hills.. fresh almost like if it never been touched. Then I saw over his shoulder was more angels like him…BUT VERY COLORFUL wings … Only ONE that stepped forward toward to me with all angels fall behind him..
I take a look at him and he was all gold in his hair, his wings, his clothing..and all other ones in different colors .. Feel oh so familiar and almost like if I knew them before.. wondered if I did or nay…
I jolted in surprise when he only smiled and send me telepathy saying, ” Yes, you do know us.. You are one of us.. OUR family.. You do not need to know names.. Not needed.. Your heart knows. ”
Then I began to think about what I saw about odd spaceship and people.. if those are real or is it someday??
All I heard one small simple word was.. ” yes ” then found myself transferred back to my home.. and woke up..
So, I am not too sure why I remember now to tell..however, I cannot inogre the dreams.. they indeed do have mystery and pictures to put puzzle together… but now I understand. But I am always still am so bewildred at what I have been told..because …
I do not always feel worthy for anything or anyone and even God himself especially because He is Father, Protector, Provider, and Almighty.. Glory and praise to Him..
* sigh * At least, I shared the dream.. and leave it for you all to think about it. Because dreams cannot be ingored at any length since HE is at hand.. So I’ve been told.
It was the 17th. of november 1975 and the experience is fresh to me even after all this time.
I was in a vision on that day. I saw that I was holding a child’s hand and trying to get away … from something. Movement was extremely difficult and so was speaking. It was as though a great fear had gotten a hold of us (me and this child). But so were all the people I saw in great fear and their faces were black! They had turned dark.
I knew it was of extreme importance to conquer this … There was an edifice infront of us with a series of steps and I thought that we could maybe find shelter there in.
But walking was so hard to do … I started to pray silently as speaking was too hard to do.
I held on to the child’s hand encouraging him to keep moving by squeezing his tiny hand.
Every word of my prayer was so hard to think of. But somehow I managed while praying so loud in my soul to reach the top of the staircase.
My prayer intensified in power … but not of my own.
There was a window at the top and I saw as I looked out these men floating on the other side, outside, at a very high altitude. They were coming in. They were going to come in through the window as though they could simply just go through. There was nothing that could stop them.
I cried out for ‘Joel’ and this time with strength.
And then I was completely frozen
End of vision.
Even hours after this aweful and terrible vision I was as paralyzed.
My heart beat was strong just pounding in my chest … I thought I would die.
I had entered a future and I knew that this lay ahead.
I didn’t know who Joel was. Years later I read the book of Joel and recognized my vision.
That day and there after The Lord told me that these … (army) were dangerous!
Abigail,
Yup, they are dangerous. I do recall that part.. I remember so many times since a child at age 3 or 4… I always have been chased by either dragon or those black figure ( all in black.. like darkest than dark itself ) … and worse.. when I got older.. It got manifest and tried every turn to make me fear them but not successful because I ended up fighting back and resisting with all my might and trusting God to guide me through it… Been fighting with them for years and years.. until after brain surgery.. for the first time, everything is.. silent. No more chasing… no more worry when I go to sleep.. That is right after that dream above you that I wrote.. is silence.. watchful… always stay alert 24/7 in wake or sleep state.
You are not alone, Abigail..
I know those type.. very familiar and seen often that I had to battle to save myself and saving others by transformed into something else I did not expect to find myself in dream state… becoming angel to guard others from those evil ones..
May God always watch you over.. He will conutine working with you and all who are HIS… He’s firm about that.
If there is any forms you have seen or shown.. I would be glad to verifty for you.. since I have seen nearly MOST of all beasts of Sheol.. and much more that are plowing on ground also.
Blessings.
Tamara,
My first vision of all my life was when I was 7 years old. I remember the age because I had received a watch from my parents for my 7th. birthday.
I was in my bedroom in the early evening …
When suddenly infront of me was The Lord with the apostles …
The Lord lifted up a cup far above His Head and gave thanks and said ‘This is my blood which is shed for you.’
Immediately blood started overflowing the cup and grew and was covering everything.
The sight frightened me so! I started to run away from this living blood.
It was so thick and was flooding the ground, like a river overflowing its banks.
As I was running away from it as fast as I could … it was pursuing me …
I was so afraid … but it kept chasing me, covering everything and by now it was like an ocean.
Then I looked at my feet and saw a dry branch , a dead branch.
Then the vision ended.
It was not a dream … Tamara … it was a vision.
Visions are very frightening because Heaven is opened for you to see when The Lord gives a vision. You see with your soul.
You see a drama outside the realm of time and understanding is given.
I have also had dreams and these are different but I cannot tell you the difference.
Except maybe that you wake up ?
Dreams from God are holy because they come from Him.
I just thought to speak to you about these things and yes God is Mighty!
Correction …
The cup was not lifted over His Head … He was holding the cup in His Hand.
A flash back and a correction from the Holy Spirit.
Sorry …
I am a woman …
It is interesting to hear of these dreams. I had one about a spaceship back in the 1970s also.
I went up inside through the bottom center of it, and saw people who had boarded, and were walking around the promenade area, and looking out a big window to the outside. They all seemed to be there voluntarily.
I had assumed I had been watching too much tv, because star trek was a favorite show of mine. But it may have had more predictive value than I thought.
People now think aliens are their creators from past ancient history, and there will be many deceived people who will willingly board UFOs to become part of what the aliens want.
Marianne,
It was not a dream! Now I don’t need brain surgery …
Another point here I don’t watch t.v. Only in this last year have I been viewing Utube.
And even at that I do not watch it for entertainment.
I was referring to the book of Joel an linking it to rev. 9 …
Whatever …
I sure don’t like to be taken lightly on what I regard a serious subject. You will see it soon as many and none will be slightly prepared. Why ? Because people scoff with no understanding at all.
Anyways have a good day.
ok..
you had a vision….tamera had a dream….
but I do take things seriously…which is why I put material on this blog, to inform others.
Hi Ladies,
I’m a little late..being March 2010 (and sorry Marianne, just HAD to say something LOL)…I have never had a vision and think that it is awesome that God would do that for you Abigail. I have had alot of “dreams” though back in my 20s (right after receiving the Baptism) The most recent one I posted on another site “who goes who stays”. Would love your thoughts on that one-The last time I had a “dream” from G-d was over 20 years ago, so I am soooo excited that I have heard from Him again.
Here is the “dream” I had on Saturday, March 13th, 2010:
I just had the most amazing dream that I had to share it here…was trying to find the right post to put it:
In my dream, I am in the passenger seat of a white truck that my friend (former friend in reality; we haven’t spoken since last summer due to her being involved in witchcraft etc) is driving. We are at the gas station. As we are turning around the corner beside the gas station I see in the sky the most AMAZING Beautiful sight! I saw the sun rays shining thru clouds and the clouds begin to make the formation of a hand. I thought this was so unique and beautiful and told my friend to LOOK, LOOK! I looked over at her and saw that she wasn’t looking at all, granted she was driving, but this was AMAZING! So I jumped out of the truck so that I wouldn’t miss such a beautiful display. I had also seen across the street another group of people, about 3 of them also getting out of their truck to look. Then the display of clouds forming into a hand actually became a real HAND! WOW….While standing there, I notice that the hand points one of its fingers and its pointing at me!!!!! Then I saw the group of people across the street looking up and then one of the ladies with them, wearing green shorts (have no idea why I remembered that) was floating upward. I thought WOW….and then I felt this most awesome tingling sensation go thru out my body (reminded me of when I received the Baptism in the HOly Spirit) and I felt myself being lifted up as well…I then realized what was going on and I looked towards my friend who was now in front of the truck looking at the same thing and I said “its the rapture! Its time! Its time!” I remember the look on her face; she was not happy…and then I thought to myself, “who is going to take care of my dogs” and then I woke up!
lyndsey said this on March 13, 2010 at 9:16 pm | Reply
hello sir,
its not like that. what jesus said. no one knows the time,date anything even the son of man knows. only god,the father knows that hour.so please dont misroute others. then u have to face the wrath of god. many things which u told is good. but not this.
dear jebakumar
You are right. There is no way to really know the date.
But what I hope to do here is create interest in the last days, and make people think about this and realize there is not much time left for them.
If they will start thinking about this, those who are not saved yet might turn their thoughts toward God, and change their lives.
So this blog prophesied the “rapture” last fall and it didn’t happen. I think that’s what is known as a false prophet. It brings damage to the the reputation of God when people make up these stupid estimates for this secret “rapture” event and then it doesn’t happen. Don’t you get that it won’t ever happen at a time it’s been propeshied for because no one knows the date? Duh! Besides, the Bible teaches that the final judgment will occur at the return Christ. That’s what those verses are talking about – not some secret disappearance that brings chaos. God is a god of order. Please look at the context of the verses. Based on the few verses that supposedly support this “rapture” idea, would anybody come up with this doctrine on their own if it hadn’t been taught to you first? That kind of interpretation is very bad exegesis. The rapture didn’t even exist as a teaching until the mid 1800s. Gee whiz. If it’s taught in the Bible, then how did all the church fathers miss it? Note that John Nelson Darby made up this doctrine after vising Scotland in 1830 and observing Margaret McDonald’s end times ramblings which he billed as demonic. He returned to Ireland and the following year (1831) he introduced his “rapture” doctrine.
Hi Edward,
If you look carefully, we did not predict the rapture to occur last year. We were saying that it could possibly occur around Passover time, of any year, and then mentioned when Passover occurred in 2009.
This did not mean to predict that it would occur then. I apologize if it came across that way.
We could have also mentioned when Passover would occur in 2010,2011, or 2012 as well.
I personally think the rapture is the same as the second coming, which would occur after the tribulation. I guess we will not know until it happens.
Hi Marianne,
Awesome blog. I have never even considered participating in one before but I am impressed with the way you meditate this. You are very Gracious.
I have a few questions for anyone to ponder and explore.
The 7 churches in Revelation, who do they represent now?
The church in Sardis is told to “Wake up!” repent, or I will come like a thief in the night. (So He will not surprise some…if they repent, they will know the time of His return? (See also 1 Thess. 5:1-11)
I also believe that the Jews who have not yet accepted Jesus as Messiah have a different fate than the Christians but do the different churches (different Christians) described in Revelation have different fates?
Also, why do some of you think that the rapture will take place on Passover? I think it likely it will be on the Feast of Trumpets and He will come to rule on the Day of Atonement.
I personally think the 144,000 will be sealed on Passover. (not that other things won’t happen on that day. God seems to do important things at His Appointed Times)
I have a lot more questions but will save them for future posts.
Thanks Marianne.
In Truth,
Malia
hi Malia
I think the 7 churches still represent 7 types of churches and church problems we see today.
There is only one fate for those who will not repent, and be born again, and one fate for those who WILL repent, and stay faithful to Jesus. Their religious and church status does not matter.
only those who have been martyred for their faith and those that remain, but are faithful are not criticized, and told to repent.
Only those who are faithful are told they will be spared from the trouble to come.
All others – Jews and untested Christians – need to brace themselves for tribulation.
The idea of coming on or around Passover comes from the concept that he will return as he left, and about the same time, to rapture the faithful, but those who go through the tribulation do not see him until 3 1/2 years later, at Armageddon, and this will be about the time of Trumpets.
However, I think the rapture will occur closer to Shavuot, which is only 50 days after Passover.
Traditionally, the 144,000 (ha-Bikkurim) are sealed on Shavuot, or Pentecost.
http://heavenawaits.wordpress.com/the-144000-and-the-rest-of-the-jews/
Shavuot commemorates the time when the first fruits (ha-Bikkurim) were harvested and brought to the Temple. The 144,000 are the Bikkurim.
So, they are sealed on Passover, but raptured on Shavuot.
Does this make any sense?
It is my understanding that Christ’s return/Rapture would be on Feasts of Trumpets as well..”no man knows the day or hour” would be feasts of trumpets. Jesus fullfilled the first 3 or 5 holidays/holy days the first go around…so he would finish out with the last 3 holidays right?
meant to write “3 or 4..not 5″
hi lyndsey
That would be the right idea……he would fulfill all feasts.
He will fulfill the next two with his second coming and judgement of the wicked ten days later. The feast of tabernacles will still be practiced throughout the millennium.
Marianne,
ou have given me something to look into. I will get back to you after I have studied some more.
Thanks!
Forgive my simplicity….when everyone says “be ready”, what exactly does this mean? Do we stock up on supplies, water, food, first aid, pay ahead on bills etc….? I can understand the need for the above if we are to stay here and go thru the tribulation but if we are being taken up with Christ (raptured) then what does “ready” imply for this? Is it spiritual ready? Physical ready?
hi lyndsey
“Be ready” could be different for each person.
Some need to read the bible and know what to expect, and strengthen their faith.
We all need to be prepared for emergency situations anyhow, even if it is not end time related.
For example, God will still be with us and protect us, but it would be nice to be prepared for a hurricane or flood in our area.
Others might need to be ready to help others…..a spare room could help someone who is moving away from a disaster area.
We all need to be wise politically, and recognize evil in government that is antichrist in nature.
Just read, understand what is to come, and then follow what God gives you in your heart to do.
Thank you Marianne! You know my concerns regarding my sons…I really have to remind myself that G-D loves us and will look out for us. With Williams’ Autism, he only eats certain things…as you can see , this would create a big problem if not able to “buy or sell”. I am truly hoping that G-d will remove us before it gets to that point.
There may be good news and bad news here. Bad news is we will all have to go thru the tribulation together – the rapture won’t happen until Christ returns on the 7th trump.
But the good news is that you won’t have to worry about buying stuff. There won’t be a chip.
All you need to do is to keep God’s commandments and you will all get thru it. He promises that in the Book of Revelation.
Revelation 14:11-12
Rev 14:11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
12Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Revelation 22:14
14Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
Those who refuse the mark keep the commandments, those who take it, do not. The mark is all about keeping God’s laws, not microchips.
These are my thoughts as to what is going on based upon the HS telling me that “it has begun” the night Obama won in 2008. I am thinking that perhaps what the HS meant by “it has begun” was the tribulation. Perhaps we are already in the tribulation period. When Obama was “officially” president it was in 2009. Now 3.5 years later -into the tribulation-would put us at 2012-LATE 2012…(Dec 21, 2012…ring a bell?) Obama would be up for relection….most likely win etc. Ok, 3 years later, 2015 is when the LAST Solar/Lunar eclipses on a Jewish Holiday occur (as noted in other posts, there were only 2 other times that Solar/lunar eclipses occured on a Jewish Holiday and that was 1945 (when Israel became a country) and 1967 (6 day war and Jerusalem was won). The next and last time this century that the Solar/Lunar eclipses occur on a Jewish Holy day will be in 2015. Matthew 24, Jesus says that “AFTER the tribulation…the sun will turn to sackcloth and the moon will turn to blood (solar and lunar eclipses) SO…….if its AFTER the tribulation…counting back 7 years….that puts us back to 2008.
hi Lyndsey
It is possibly true…..we might be deeper into this than we realize. Much of what has been predicted is already occurring in other countries…America has been protected so far, but that is changing……
According to most folks (not me) the tribulation will not begin until a one-world government has been created and a charismatic leader has taken power over all nations on earth. Obama is clearly not that man, no one seems to know who he is going to be. So you must wait patiently for the New World Order to become a reality. But don’t worry, many say it is just around the corner. Until then don’t be distracted with US politics. The “antichrist” will come from Europe.
As for 2015, it is not a factor. Look ahead. The eclipse theory was interesting, but ultimately it was just some ones fervent imagination. You get that a lot in prophecy.
Hope this helps.
Hi James,
This is the link where I got the information regarding the solar/lunar eclipses in 2014/2015 occuring on a Jewish Holy Day…the information came also from the US gov Nasa website…
http://www.triumphpro.com/blood-red-lunar-eclipses-and-solar-eclipses.htm
“Astonishing as it seems, four lunar eclipses will occur on
God’s annual Holy Days during Passover and Sukkot in the
years 2014 and 2015, and two solar eclipses on Nisan 1 and
the Feast of Trumpets! These are exceedingly rare occurrences,
especially when they dovetail with God’s Holy Days! What
does it all mean? What is the prophetic significance? It’s
time to wake up and take heed of these ominous, fateful
warnings from heaven!” (William F. Dankenbring)
*with our “increase of knowledge/technology” we are fortunate in that we are able to actually see “the signs in the heavens” that Jesus talked about!
Thanks for the link, it was interesting. For a moment I though you were saying that NASA was suggesting the eclipses were biblically related. Now that would have surprised me.
In any case they may indeed be signs of the second coming. They are not a new discovery however. These eclipses were predicted a thousand years ago. Even the ancient Mayans could have predicted them. The fact that they fall on Jewish holy days may have only recently been realized since the Mayans and European astronomers were probably not into the Jewish festivals, and the Jews wouldn’t relate them to the return of Jesus, so the correlation was not discovered until recently.
That may have been by design if they are indeed end-time prophecy. It may be that a piece of prophecy will be fulfilled on each of those days or within that time frame. Perhaps the false prophet will take the throne on one of those days.
While it won’t be the second coming it may herald the beginning of the decade before the tribulation.
Personally I think “signs in the heavens” may be something more spectacular than a few simple eclipses. I think they may be a sign to everyone that God is real and he is on his way back.
All we can really do is wait patiently, spread the word and get ready.
Are you familar with the heavenly sign that began Sept 29 (Feasts of Trumpets) and continued until 11-11-11?
Very clear, when seen with Stellaium astonomy software. You can only see the heavenly sign with software or math/charts because it occurs during the daylight hours (“she is clothed in the sun”). It was the sign of Rev 12:1-3 and the later verses in the chapter that describe the war in heaven.
To see this, someone would need to “know” the signs in the heavens, be looking up. understand the same signs of His birth and Day of the Cross to know and recognize this sign. It is not for the average Joe. Seems to me to be a sign for believers and watchters.
In my opinion, the 7 year period started, if not with this sign on Feasts of Trumpets on Sept 29, 2011, then it was September 2010. That is when a signature was placed on a peace agreement by all parties concerned (EU, USA, Arab Leaders, and Israel).
These are a few key lines from a new story on the event in the Jerusalem Post, September 2010.
“It is now time for decisions, not for negotiations,” he said, and referred to building moratorium saying that the next few days would be key in determining the direction of progress. “We have reached agreement on the agenda of the direct talks,” Erekat said. “We have also reached agreement on a timeline for a temporary framework agreement – 12 months.”
Netanyahu also said in Washington that the goal of the talks was to reach a framework agreement within a year, meaning an agreement in principle on the core issues between the leaders, with the negotiating teams left to work out all the details. In private meetings, Netanyahu has dismissed as secondary domestic political concerns, saying that what was important was “to reach an agreement I believe in.”
Israeli officials would not confirm any of Erekat’s claims, saying that it was agreed in Washington that the content of the talks would not be leaked. Netanyahu, when asked in Washington why he was saying nothing about the content of the negotiations, told journalists, “You want headlines, I want an agreement.”
PA negotiators who were in Washington last week for the launch of the direct talks spoke with some optimism about “understandings” and “agreements” that were achieved in meetings between the two sides.”
This was a confidential, behind closed door meeting in Washington DC. Obama, King of Jordan, EU leaders, Erekat and Netanyhau all present. There was a grand picture of Obama walking with King of Jordan and president of Egypt down the White House hallway. An “agreement” was reached to advance peace talks. That is a process move with an understanding that the details will be worked out and “peace will be achieved”.
The solar/lunar cycle of 2015, on Feasts days in September – a Sabbatical month, during a Sabbatical year along with the 1948 to 2018 spread of a 70 year generation, tells me that we are within the seventh week of Daniel.
I’ve posted something on the 4 seals that maybe of interest to you too. I think the fiery red horse is out of the barn!
DJ,
You are referring to the fact that the sun is located in the constellation Virgo at that time of the year. It is there EVERY year and has been for a couple thousand years. But it doesn’t stay in the same constellation forever. Due to the precession of the equinoxes it slowly slides around the zodiac every 26,000 years. So at the time of Christ, the sun would not have been in Virgo until Oct/Nov.
So anyway, there is no reason to use this occurrence as a prophetic sign.
As for the “peace covenant” you mentioned, it is irrelevant since the 70th week of Daniel has already been fulfilled – by Jesus – and the covenant was in fact the New Covenant of the New Testament. Many people who believe in the “Left Behind” books have taken the 70th week into the future and applied it to the Antichrist, but if you read the text carefully you will realize that it was about the Messiah and His 7-year plan to preach the New Testament to the Jews, but half-way thru He was killed (cut off). The 7 years ends with the stoning of Steven when Jews rejected Jesus as their savior and thus the Christian era began.
Those people who are looking for an Antichrist figure to make a 7-year peace plan are in for a long wait. Instead I believe they will take any old peace agreement they can find and try to turn it into something that it is not.
But I’m curious, if the first seal – white horse (the Antichrist) – has been broken and the peace plan set into motion, would you like to tell us just who the Antichrist is?
As for the red horse (WW3) – I don’t see it just around the corner right now. I couldn’t find the post you mentioned so I’ll wait till I can read it before adding more.
Bless…
I have noticed that when I talk to people about what I have learned here on your site and how Jesus’ return is closer than we thought, they just look at me and smile and sometimes actually laugh! I am honestly trying to be a witness for Christ and trying to let them know how real this is. I could just imagine what Noah and his family went through!
lyndsey
Do not be disheartened.
I go through this also, with my own family members, even “church” people. Somehow truth has been so elevated and disconnected from most people that an ordinary person does not seem to have any right to it.
They see us as no one special, so why should we have special insights?
The answer is the holy spirit, but they do not see this, because they lack him in their lives.
Just keep trying. Even a seed of truth will eventually grow. We might not be around to see it, but God will make all seeds grow.
So true! Thank you marianne…william is holding my left hand and refusing to let me type….lol…awwww…life is full…another day in paradise
Are you for real? A day in Paradise?
In it are lies!
Huh?
May I ask Abigail what you are talking about? “Are you for real? A day in Paradise?
In it are lies!”…this doesn’t make any sense…
I like this song. I like to post songs too. Abigail likes to write poetically. I don’t have that gift either, let alone writing. We can’t all be the head? I’ll be satisfied with being a toe.
According to Jesus, in Hos very own words, there will be NO rapture prior to His return anyhow. Just read Matt 24 with due care and attention. Rapture theory is flawed.
Like in Noah,s days, expect to be taken aside for your own safety. Read Revelation 12……..and don’t speculate so much, it only confuses people. Silently trust the Lord………
29 “Immediately ***after the misery*** of those days, the sun will turn dark, the moon will not give light, the stars will fall from the sky, and the powers of the universe will be shaken. 30 “Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky. All the people on earth will cry in agony when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds in the sky with power and great glory. 31 He will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and from every direction under the sky, they will gather those whom God has chosen.
Matthew 24:29-31 (GOD’S WORD to the Nations)
The woman was given the two wings of the large eagle in order to fly away from the snake to her place in the wilderness, where she could be taken care of for a time, times, and half a time. Revelation 12:14 (GOD’S WORD to the Nations)
I agree with the picture of Noah’s day. 7 days were given to Noah to gather into the arc just as 7 days of Unleavened Bread seem to picture a week of being consecrated in preparation of meeting the Lord. Scriptures suggests that the 3 harvests of Israel, seen in the 3 Main Feasts of Israel, point to and picture the 3 steps of harvest God commanded the Jews to follow. This also points to the 3 signs Paul mentioned in 2 Thes and justifies the 3 differnet groups of people seen in Revelation(those of all nations of an uncountable number, the 144,000 Jewish men who consecrated themselves before being taken(hence they didnt sleep with their wives), and those who overcame the Mark of the Beast and were also martyrs).
*note: Marital sex of course isnt a sin no more than food is a sin but men are commanded to fast from food and consecrate from marital sex when about to meet the Lord for there is a time and place for everything.
hi Jamar
Thanks for your comment. I look forward to the feasts offered by Yeshua when he returns. Trouble is ahead of us, but beyond that the hope of the ages will be here, to make things right again.
We Are As The Days of Noah Now…God rescued the Righteous (Noah, and his family! Lot, and his family) prior to his Judgment (Wrath) on those Left Behind. Just as us Saved Born Again (New Creatures) Rapture before the Tribulation (Wrath)
Noahs Ark, As The Days Of Noah Rapture
http://www.raptureprophecy.net/noahs-ark-as-the-days-of-noah-rapture
hi rapture
I see the end time divided into 2 parts : Tribulation and Wrath
We would be here for the tribulation, since the martyrdom of saints is mentioned, and then gone for the Wrath period.
The remaining saints leave at the 6th seal, when the wrath begins. So to me, the rapture would occur at the 6th seal.
Before that time, there may be a fake rapture initiated by satan, which new agers call the ascension, and this is due in 2012, from what I understand.
http://heavenawaits.wordpress.com/fire-brimstone-the-ascension/
those that “ascend” are going to a bad situation.
So, we should be alert to the spirit of God to guide us, and not be deceived by any devices of the enemy.
that is what I think, anyhow.
be blessed.
God did not remove Noah from the flood, He merely warned him that it was coming so that he could be prepared. But Noah and his family were surrounded by the flood and it rained on them for forty days. Christians have been warned about the coming tribulation so we may be prepared for it. We will not be getting a free pass by being whisked to heaven. Such a move is unnecessary and without biblical precedence.
Sure, a rapture would be pretty cool and all, but I’m afraid its no more than wishful thinking.
I wouldn’t get too attached to the idea if I were you.
In addition to the individuals mentioned above by “Rapture”, apparently a PRECEDENT for this type of thing has already been established and foreshadowed with Enoch, (Genesis 5:24) where the English word “took” in the King James, was translated from the Hebrew word “לקח”, transliterated “laqach” (Strong’s 3947). The primary definitions of this word are, “to take, get, fetch, lay hold of, seize, receive, acquire, buy, bring, marry, take a wife, snatch, and take away.”
There is also Elijah, (2 Kings 2:11) where the author of that particular book, (who is unknown), expressed a more wonderfully detailed description of a similar event. Whatever the case, God has obviously chosen to do this before. It is right there in black and white for everyone to read. So I really don’t understand as to why there are any Christians that refuse to believe that it could very well be possible that He may choose to do it again?
For just one out of many examples there is Psalms 18:2.
“The LORD is my rock, and my fortress, “and my deliverer” ; my God, my strength, in whom I will trust ; my buckler, and the horn of my salvation, and my high tower.”
The words translated into the English “and my deliverer” is from the Hebrew “פלט” transliterated as “palat” (Strong’s 6403).
Its definitions are;
1) to escape, save, deliver, slip away
a) (Qal) to escape
b) (Piel)
1) to bring into security, deliver
2) to cause to escape, cast forth
3) to be delivered
4) to slip away
c) (Hiphil) to bring into security, bring to safety
Note that within the definition above, it doesn’t imply anywhere that “to be delivered” has any implication in respects to punishment.
Be Blessed
The “rapture” of a couple of God’s favorite prophets can not be compared to a billion modern-day Christians. I believe God has a special purpose for Enoch and Elijah, perhaps as His two witnesses who must eventually be killed and therefore can not yet have a spiritual body. They were not removed from earth for their own protection, so there is no real analogy there.
And why take them all to heaven? If they are transformed into spiritual beings, they are safe from death, so there is no need to remove them from harms way. Why not let them stay and preach to the masses?
I think if a pre-trib rapture were real, the bible would have been absolutely clear about it and there would be no room for discussion.
I think anyone who is arrogant enough to assume that God is going to personally save them is probably not the type of person He would actually save.
Be humble. Ask God that you might do His work during the tribulation, not be rescued from it.
Peace.
Quote from above; “The “rapture” of a couple of God’s favorite prophets can not be compared to a billion modern-day Christians.”
Why not?
Quote from above; “I believe God has a special purpose for Enoch and Elijah, perhaps as His two witnesses who must eventually be killed and therefore can not yet have a spiritual body. They were not removed from earth for their own protection, so there is no real analogy there.”
Well I believe that more than likely both Enoch and Elijah will be the two witnesses. However within that sentence are you saying that God has no special purpose in store for those that have accepted His Son Yeshua?
As well, is there not the possibility that you are limiting God within the remainder of that sentence by stating that neither of them could have a spiritual body? He could very well have given both of them a spiritual body just as easily as He could return them in a fleshy one. Or do you suppose that this would perhaps be to difficult for Him to perform?
I agree that as far as we know, that they were not removed for their own protection, however the analogy would be relevant to the act itself as being performed, rather than the circumstance or reason for it.
Quote from above, “And why take them all to heaven?”
Because they have overcome the world, and maintained and practiced their faith. They have been purchased by the shedding of His blood and are His possession, His Bride.
Quote from above; “Why not let them stay and preach to the masses?”
I believe that those that will do exactly that, are described quite clearly within scripture.
Quote from above; “I think if a pre-trib rapture were real, the bible would have been absolutely clear about it and there would be no room for discussion.”
I believe that the premise itself is expressed with extreme clarity. However if we were to take your statement and apply it to the whole of scripture, not only would this site not exist, (for the necessity of discussion itself regarding any topic, would be redundant), but there would only be one faith as well. So just because we happen to have those that accept the premise, and those who do not, does not eliminate it as being a distinct possibility.
Quote from above; “I think anyone who is arrogant enough to assume that God is going to personally save them is probably not the type of person He would actually save.”
That is why I am grateful that you are not God.
Be Blessed
Hi JG and Alie!
Glad you both agree that a post-tribulation rapture is a possibility. : )
Say, what do you think about the following verse? Who are the “my people” of this verse?
Isa 26:20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers, and shut thy doors about thee: hide thyself for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast.
Isa 26:21 For, behold, Jehovah cometh forth out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain.
Hey 45, How ya doing?
I guess there was a small break in communication there.
I’m not a Post-Tribber in regards to the Resurrection. I’m a Pre-Tribber!
Much of my ideology can be found below;
http://heavenawaits.wordpress.com/rapture-and-church-of-philadelphia/
Yeah, I was called away into prayer regarding a matter…
And yeah, also figured you were(are) a Pre-Tribber. Was only addressing the Tribber part : ), as a common frame of reference to pose a question to the both of you regarding Isaiah 26:20.
Will go to the link and read…
Sorry 45.
Okay…. Isaiah 26:20,21. is either part of the preceding song, or an introduction regarding something new.
Either way, in holding a Pre-Trib point of view, it is my belief that the “people” there would be referring to the Jews.
Be blessed
The two witnesses show up right at the time the Anti-Christ shows his true self, and walks into the Holy of Holies pronouncing himself all things to all people.
I think that would be the time of a rapture. To take those who believe in Christ away from the wrath of G-d about to be given to mankind.
The Bible states when you see this to flee to the wilderness. Eligah had to flee after taking off 300 Bael priest heads.
As we are slated for fire this time, and not water, it might be a good idea to have a USMC ammo dumb type shelter in the wilderness. Complete with wine, and MRE’S. Don’t forget ammo, BDU’s…
sounds good. Leatherneck, I want to come stay with you….!
Hi ya Leatherneck,
I believe that the Two Witnesses will show up “right at the beginning of the Tribulation”, and will prophecy for 1260 days, “before” they are killed by the beast that comes out of the bottomless pit.
I don’t think that you will need that shelter.
Be Blessed
With all the Tornados, and 120 heat, a strong well stocked shelter is in order.
Marianne, you are welcome in the shelter. I hope you like corn bread, beans, and deer meat.
my “shelter” is just my house with supplies. Nothing underground. Is that what you have?
Right now my only shelter is G-d’s grace in christ’s name. But, he tells me to square my nasty self away with a Marine Corp ammo dump in the wilderness to secure my wife, and child. Or, I am so scared of another 400 tornados, earthquakes, and 500 year floods, I think I am suppose to hide from the wrath of G-d I see happening.
I have 40 acres in southeast Oklahoma down in a creek bottom. I have been improving it, but the ammo dumb I want costs $12,000. Add $2500 for a water well.
I bet if Noah was alive right now, he would die of a heart attack seeing all the murder, wars, and homo marriage.
This winter is mild. What does the spring bring? Is it tied with how our government is helping terrorists?
I got one acre in a residential neighborhood….I am not allowed to have my own well because there is a community well, and they have been given a monopoly. I have about 1000 rounds. and 3 guns
I think the winters will be mild again next year, but still cold enough to be called winter.
I think spring will bring many threats but there will be delays in events, as the powers that be want to be re-elected. Everything will go south after november.
Beans taste good, but oh my, the flatulence smell accumulation in those close quarters! Hope someone remembers to bring a hefty supply of beano, simethicone, or digestive enzyme tablets… Hope also the Lord blesses you with a good ventilation system. : )
Lol. I was just kidding about the beans.
One main question to be answered here is whether the faithful will be protected here on earth during the tribulation or will they be taken all the way to heaven for that purpose. Simple logic makes a trip to heaven unlikely. First of all, scripture only says we will meet Jesus in the clouds/air, but does not indicate that we go any further. Logic says that if we have been transformed into spirit beings, we are already protected and going to heaven is a waste of time. It would also be a waste of valuable resources, to take all those Christians from a world who could really use them during trying times with God’s enemies in charge of things.
Also, why resurrect the dead too? Are they to be in danger as well? Maybe for a little heavenly vacation? It just doesn’t make sense. And what’s to do in heaven? Cable TV? Checkers? Might be pretty boring for most of us. But maybe time doesn’t exist in heaven. Perhaps that’s why Enoch and Elijah can be returned alive as two witnesses. If that’s the case, we won’t even know we were ever there. Maybe we will be here one minute and a moment later we awake with Christ in the air as He returns for real.
Which brings me to my main point…
Everyone is so worried about perishing in the Great Tribulation. They are willing to go to extremes to try to survive, including building shelters and stocking up on supplies etc. But Jesus tells us that those who try to save their lives will lose them and those who lose their life will receive eternal life. So what is everyone so scared for? If we die, we wake up an instant later with the Lord in the air, perhaps the same as the rapture, so what’s the difference.
Jesus died for you on the cross. Are you unwilling to do the same for Him? You are already guaranteed everlasting life, don’t you want to spend part of yours doing His work? The apostles all did it. The Christians that were thrown to the lions did it. The original martyrs of the early church did it. Where was their rapture? Why are we so much more deserving than they were?
Well friends, we are not. It is simply our turn. What we make of it may determine our rewards in the kingdom of God.
Keep that in mind while you sit back and wait for your ticket to ride.
God bless and good luck either way.
I’ll see you in the lion’s den.
It is one thing to write I will die for Christ, it is another to do it. Easy to say, but hard to do.
I hope I can do it if/when my time comes, and not reach for my Mossberg.
For me, it is the physical pain I do not want my wife, or child to have. Unless you are Amish, is it hard to understand that?
When I was younger, I thought I could not ship evil men. Now, after serving for my country, I know shipping evil men is the right thing to do.
shipping?
Also known as getting rid of, or sending to G-d.
JG you are certainly more stimulating than the ‘cow rapture video’ much earlier in this thread. You made several great points. Thank you.
Dying: “Will it hurt?” Probably. (no matter how it comes)
The idea of martyrdom is very scary to my flesh. Dying to the flesh is far easier said than done, i.e. embracing the cross unto full surrender. If and whenever a person is ‘blessed’ with a near death experience, then the reality of finite limits to this mortal body begins to sink into clear focus. And in that moment of acknowledging one’s own mortal end, a question sometimes comes to mind: “Since I am going to die no matter what, and the method of that death may potentially bring an eternal reward, then; Does not wisdom declare the more prudent method of exiting life to be one in which an eternal reward can be laid hold of?”
“He is no fool who gives up what he cannot keep, to gain that which he cannot lose.” – - quote of Jim Elliott (modern day martyr of Jesus)
Speaking of Lions. If I’m not mistaken, a lion’s method killing its prey is only to pin its victim to the ground so as to be able to bite down on the neck to sufficate it. Only once dead does the feast begin. So lions have little interest in useless expenditure of energy to torture victims, especially victims which yield themselves to the lion’s power. In this way, Lions are merciful. Torture is more common among humans who are filled with demons, not so common from animals. And while the thought of decapitation has been dramatised as horrendously wicked, it actually is a pretty quick and relatively painless way of dying.
The nature channel shows lions eating before the victim is dead. Again, we we want to do is easy to write, but when your child is screaming how easy will it be then.
Which brings another point. G-d watched his only son be murdered for us. Could we do the same? I am sure I would reach for the Mossberg to ship any evil men that would do such a thing if I refuse to take the mark.
G-d said we would not be sent to hell for picking up the sword, but die by it. I just hope I am strong in the Lord when it is my time to choose.
Hope I’ve given everyone something to think about. I’ve been in some medical conditions where I have made my peace with God and told Him if He wants to take me now I’ll be seeing Him soon go ahead.
As for being tortured by the Antichrist, I don’t believe that will happen, so it doesn’t worry me. But Jesus would most likely protect us from that if it were to go down. It’s the 2nd- 4th seals that will take the most lives. War and its aftermath are common to much of the world and the center of action will be the middle east so we can’t be certain how America will fare, but the war will be of man’s own doing and not the wrath of God, so why should we expect Him to protect us from ourselves? By the time the wrath does occur those without the mark will be under His protection and should make it to the second coming. Even those with the mark will make it, as Revelation says they will receive the last plagues and will wish for death but it will not come.
I’m sure there will be hardship all over the planet, but that is already true in many countries, so richer countries will simply get a taste of what they are going through already. With the state of the economy deteriorating as it is, we may get there before the seals are even opened. Heck, many people are predicting a financial collapse and a major world war (over oil) regardless of what the bible says. So God or not, the suffering may be the same.
My point is that pain and suffering have been part of the human condition since the fall of Adam. If the Jews were not spared from the holocaust, then I can’t be sure we will be spared from the tribulation, nor should we be.
All we need to do is keep our faith in Jesus and remember that the short time we spend in human bodies is nothing when compared to an eternity with the Lord. With that in mind, we can get thru just about anything, wouldn’t you say?
Bless.
James I am sorry to read you are sick. I enjoy reading your posts.
The Bible reads the Anti-Christ will make war with the Saints. The Bible reads to flee to the wilderness. Why do you pick, and choose?
We should be smart.
Hi ya James,
Placing ideology and interpretation aside, I am sorry to hear that you are experiencing some medical issues.
I pray that the Lord cradles you within His loving hands, and keeps you close within His heart.
Take Care,
Be Blessed.
“and told Him if He wants to take me now I’ll be seeing Him soon go ahead.”
I know this prayer cause its left my lips also. Appreciate your transperancy.
Will very much enjoy your fellowship in heaven James,
but for now I will be praying you don’t arrive there before me.
Hows that for greed and envious competition? : )
Shalom, my brother.
hi james
Wishing you health and healing.
Thank you all for your kind words. While I am looking forward to getting my right leg back in the millennium, I do hope I can hang around a bit longer and to help do the Lord’s work.
As for me fleeing to the wilderness, that’s not going to be easy for me, so I’ll just stay and fight if it ever comes down to it. Worst case is I get to flash forward to the clouds with Christ, which probably beats hunkering down in a bunker for a few years, so I won’t complain.
For now, I’m feeling fine, I have many friends and we help one another out with whatever we can, so life is good.
If Satan is coming soon, fine. Bring him on, I’ll be ready for the good fight.
Hope you’ll all be there with me. Together we can overcome.
Bless.
You are welcome in the bunker you know JG, per Jer31:8. Flashing forward might be easier than bunker hunkering, but your wit and love for the John16:13 Spirit of Truth would make bunker-life more tolerable, so there is purpose if you feel up to it. And afterwards, for sure I will get a kick out seeing you Isa35:6 leap like a deer in the restoration of all things! (no pun intended)
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Jer 31:8 Behold, I will bring them from the north country and gather them from the corners of the earth, and with them the blind AND THE LAME, the woman with child and she who is in labor with child, together; a great company shall return there.
Hey, if God’s word must be spread from bunkers, then I’m in!
But if I’m right, we won’t be hiding from an evil Antichrist, so bunkers won’t be necessary, except to survive WW3 of course.
So if we don’t both get nuked, it sounds like a plan!