Why Jews reject Jesus…unfulfilled prophesies
I sometimes see inquiries by Christians who cannot understand why Jews reject Jesus as Messiah, since to them, Jesus fulfilled “all” prophesies.
What Christians need to understand is that Jesus did NOT fulfill all messianic prophesies while he was here.
So in order to properly witness their faith, Christians need to be able to explain the unfulfilled prophesies, and prove that, according to prophesy, the Messiah will return to complete this task. They need to back their argument up with scripture and do a good job of it. Jews are very academic, and do not accept weak arguments. Remember, they have suffered a lot in history for making the mistake of straying from Judaism, and pursuing the wrong religion.
Here is a short list of some prophecies:
Is there universal knowledge of one G-d? (Jeremiah 31:33, Zechariah 8:23, 14:9, 14:16, Isaiah 11:9, Isaiah 40:5, Zephaniah 3:9)
Were all Jews returned to Israel? (Isaiah 43:5-6, Isaiah 11:12, Isaiah 27:12-13)
Did he bring world peace? (Isaiah 11:6, Micah 4:3)
Were all weapons destroyed? (Ezekiel 39:9)
Did all warfare cease? (Isaiah 2:4)
Was the Temple rebuilt in it’s place? (Ezekiel 37:24-28 Ezekiel 40-48, Isaiah 33:20, Micah
4:1)
Did he bring physical restoration to all who are sick or disabled in any way? (Isaiah 35:5-6)
Was he preceded by Elijah? (Malachi 3:23-24– 4:4-5 in KJV)
Did the nations help the Jews materially? (Isaiah 60:5, 60:10-12, 61:6)
Does eternal joy and gladness characterize the Jewish nation? (Isaiah 51:11)
Are Jews sought for spiritual guidance? (Zechariah 8:23)
Is the Egyptian river dry yet? (Isaiah 11:15)
Do trees in Israel yield new fruit every month? (Ezekiel 47:12)
Did each tribe receive it’s inheritance? (Ezekiel 47:13-14)
Is the enemy buried? (Ezekiel 39:12)
Did he accomplish these tasks without tiring or failing? (Isaiah 42:4)
Did death cease? (Isaiah 25: 8)
Are the dead resurrected? (Isaiah 26:19, Daniel 12:2, Ezekiel 37:12-13)
Then no, Jesus is not messiah.
Also
they do not believe the Messiah is divine, but human only
Torah says that no one can die for another’s sins
they do not accept the virgin birth doctrine
they do not accept the “trinity” concept. It violates the Shema, the oneness of God
they never saw peace and deliverance in Israel due to the presence of Jesus
many do not trust Christians, after centuries of betrayal and persecution by them.
To properly explain why Yeshua did not fulfill all prophecies, one must be able to understand the divine plan for the missions Yeshua had. To read more about God’s prophetic divine plan for the 2 trips Yeshua was to make to fulfill all prophesies
Click here to read more
Another point of disagreement is the divinity of Messiah. Did the scriptures describe a man or a supernatural being who was to come?
Click here to read more
Jewish references (further reading):
http://judaism.about.com/library/3_askrabbi_o/bl_simmons_messiah3.htm
http://www.gotquestions.org/Jews-reject-Jesus.html
http://www.helium.com/items/653783-almost-definition-judaism-rejection
possibly helpful sites for discussion.
http://www.geocities.com/cobblestoneministries/2006/Jews_Jesus.html
https://heavenawaits.wordpress.com/did-jesus-fulfill-the-jewish-scriptures-for-messiah/
Heaven Awaits 
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Why Jews reject Jesus…unfulfilled prophesies « Heaven Awaits said this on April 21, 2008 at 11:45 pm |
Dear Marianne,
Could the “rejection” be the sole cause of the Jew’s sufferings until now?
Regards,
msu_74
Hi msu_74
Yes – rejection – that would be part of it.
Remember also, that Satan has been their enemy since they were first formed as the nation that would bring forth the Messiah.
So that is a big factor as well.
Finally, realize that at some point, or at many points, in our own lives, we have rejected him too.
Yes, I also agree. In all the old testament chapters the “Jehovah” said through Moses to obey his commandments and warned that if they do not follow his commandments or alleviate, they will be scattered from the Promised Land and again said that all the curse which is written therein will be befallen on them. Again God said that if they repent, the almighty will gather them to the Promised land, which has happened in the year 1948…Shalom.
Mathew George
Yes Mathew. You are right. 1948 return of the jews to Israel fulfills the visions described by Daniel and John. However, I think that most jews or israelites living in present-day Israel, are not better than their ancestors. Trully, God allowed them to return, not because they are “righteous”, but because God fulfils His Word and His Will. Glory be given to Jesus Christ.
Jill Levine, noted Bible Scholar, has some interesting YouTube lectures on the Jewish faith. She is Jewish and teaches a class on Old Testament. She has been on the History Channel, and very interesting to listen to. You can go to YouTube and find some of her lectures.
hi Maxine
I will try to look up Jill Levine. You are welcome to post some of her videos, if you want.
Well, of course, there are MANY UNfulfilled prophecies. But, let me ask you somehing: do you think that a human “Messiah” can bring WORLD PEACE? Or can make THE ENTIRE WORLD turn towards the Jews for SPIRITUAL guidance? You know MANY people don’t trust nowadays Jews, and some even despise them, you can’t really hope a human can achieve this. Do you think, MOST OF ALL, that a human can abolish DEATH in the world? Come on! For God’s sake! Only God can make that and, for those who claim that God can’t act unto this world, what do you say about Isaiah 9:6? It clearly is a Messianic prophecy, and it states that “For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given […] his name shall be called […] The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.” So, can Jews call a human “Almighty God”?
I love Jews, as they are the “Chosen Seed”, but it hurts me seeing them try to discredit the ways of God and His infinite love for this world. I leave you with a passage that clearly talks about the Jews and Jesus. Peace be upon you, Jewsih brethren.
“The stone which the builders refused is become the head stone of the corner.” – Psalm 188:22
Hi Joseph
I agree. If you ever look at the Tenach, it is translated differently, so it does not call the child the mighty God. It is like switching parts of speech. It is more like the mighty god, and everlasting father calls the child to be a prince. If you look at Isaiah 9 and 10, you will also see that the king asked for a sign that the armies would be defeated, and the sign of the child was given. Later, his wife had a child, which was considered the prophecy fulfilled.
hi Marianne,
well, that would make sense if it wasn’t because of the order of the paragraph, which leaves no doubts about who it is talking about. I should agree that there’s some controversy surrounding this passage, but the general consensus is as follows:
“And he will be given the name
Pele-Yo’etz El Gibbor [Wonder of a Counselor, Mighty God,]
Avi-‘Ad Sar-Shalom. [Father of Eternity, Prince of Peace]”
As you see, it says “He will be given the name” following the titles, which doesn’t make sense if you separate them altogether to make it a whole new statement.
Still, as I said, it doesn’t matter who is right or who is wrong, what it really matters is the fact that we are brothers in God, forever and ever. Peace be upon you.
dear Joseph
I apologize for being lazy. I was trying to go from memory, instead of looking it up. This is how it is translated:
Tenach interpretation notes:
This wonderful salvation took place in the days of the child of Ahaz, the righteous King Hezekiah, whom God – the Wondrous Advisor, Mighty God, Eternal Father – called the Prince of Peace.
Other conditions surrounding the birth of the child, who was to be a sign to Azaz that the enemies of Judah would not overtake his kingdom:
verses
Later after the birth of Hezekiah, God sent Egypt and Assyria to overtake the northern kingdom of Israel. Thus, the enemies were defeated as prophesied.
Have you checked the accuracy of the masoretic translation of scriptures, in regard to messianic prophecies? I trust if you look into this you will find evidence that certain messianic prophecies have been altered in the masoretic translations. This became evident when verses were compared with the Dead Sea scrolls and the verses therein. There is a similar case with the Jehovah’s Witness translation of the New Testament. For example, John 1:1 “the Word was God” in all other translations, but a simple change that altered the whole meaning and occurring in the JW translation “the Word was a God”
Luke
I accept the king james version. I am not a dead sea scholar….are you one?
It’s nice to see that you put your knowledge and reason above God’s. Seeing that you are not reasoning your argument from the writings of those who lived (and died) for the name of Jesus you are giving a partial picture. Jesus did in fact fulfill all prophecies, even the ones you cannot see. David saw his Lord standing next to his Lord. The Elohim were in the beginning of Genesis implying multiplicity of one (i.e. trinity). He perfectly fit the timeline of Daniel’s prophecy and is the only person, ever, who could fit the hallmarks of the messiah. Etc… He eradicated death for those who believe in Him, God in flesh. Just because you cannot “see” the proof the promises of God are for the living in this life and the next.
You trust the writings of Maimonides, a philosopher and doctor, but ignore the commands God gave you in the Tanach. You are so much wiser than God, eh? Unharden your heart and circumcise it for the sake of trusting the living God.
hi Brett,
If you read the post, it lists the prophesies that have not been fulfilled yet.
Of course Yeshua did not fulfill all prophesies, the Jewish leaders of the time ordered him killed before he had the chance to even get started. They all dispised him because he did not come from one of their highly regarded royal families.
It is still the same today, if you are not rich, famous or in a high position in society you are discredited.
When is this world, truly going to take heed of any one of it’s religous scriptures and begin to act accordingly to them.
All I see is blasphemy from all religious and political leaders. And not ONE is willing to help the other. Man fights over land that TRULY belongs to no-one, but infact is for all to share equally and for all to prosper from that sharing regardless of colour or creed.
The problem with “man” is he/she gets greedy for power and forgets where he/she once came from.
The one true prophecy is that mankind should be willing help one another to help all of mankind progress each other.
the one and only commandment any of us should follow is “treat others how you would liked to be treated” and all the other such commandments will follow suit.
hi Marino
True. God has allowed mankind to see what a failure he is to handle and rule the kingdom of God. This is why Jesus has to return. Only Jesus can rule with a pure, righteous and perfect manner. By the time He returns, which is soon I hope, people will not want a natural man to rule over them. They will only settle for God himself.
The thing is we are all ONE part of God, so unless we all start working as ONE, that will never happen. God made man in his image, the image in God’s mind. Remember we are all just matter and energy supplying matter and energy endlessly. if you can think of a multi dimensional spiders web all connected to each other.
A wise man once told me “close your eyes and all you see is MINE (IN ME), open your eyes and all you see is MINE (IN ME).
Man created words and maths (symbols) to explain “man’s” version of existance and not the truth.
“Man’s” laws only apply to “man” on “man’s” earth.
Man’s perception of all is man’s history (his story) of all and again not the truth. All this because of power and greed.
Amen.
I just read what you guys posted as prophesies that needed to have been fulfilled. Are you people serious?
What a load of crap. Why are you even wasting your time.
But I bet you still want that tribal inheritance and material help. Anything for some money right?
Keep dreaming Jews.
What the Jews are looking for to be established with their prophesies appears to be all powerful Zionist dictatorship.
As far as supremacy, fascism, totalitarianism and dictatorships go. . too each his own.
Why did Jews transform their Holy temple into a “den of thieves”? Why did they mutate their most honored and respected Holy Temple into a merchants paradise?
There is seriously something inherently and biologically wrong with your Hebrew genetic code. It is as if it’s in your blood to turn a buck under any circumstance and situation possible. Even if it means the defilement of your god’s personal temple.
Your people are nothing but filth and that is the reason why great strives have been taken to eradicate your miserable and sick breed from the face of this earth.
It is because of your dysfunctional nature. Your deformed and irresponsible behavior goes against the spirit and progress of human evolution and the health and well-being of this planet.
Jews are nothing more than a parasite.
you must be a muslim
You are denying Isaiah’s prophecy about the Messiah! therefore, you are denyin the Messiah Yeshua
“He was wounded for our transgressions, He was bruised for our iniquities. The chastisement for our peace was upon Him, and by His stripes we are healed. All we like sheep have gone astray. We have turned, every one, to his own way. And the Lord has laid on Him the iniquity of us all.
Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise Him. He has put Him to grief. When You make His soul an offering for sin. Therefore I will divide Him a portion with the great, and He shall divide the spoil with the strong, because He poured out His soul unto death, and He was numbered with the transgressors, and He bore the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.
(Isaiah 53:4-6,10,12)
I am not sure if you are addressing the post, or someone who left a comment.
The post indicates that there are still unfulfilled prophecies which will finally be fulfilled when Yeshua returns. it is not denying who he is. It is talking about his timing.
in the meantime, Jews need this explained – that Yeshua fulfilled some of he prophecies, and will do the rest later, which is actually soon.
the bible predicts that he will be cut off, but not for himself, and then he will return.
–
Shalom, I was Messianic for 15yrs, and I am glad to have recently come out of this false stuff, and I really enjoy Scripture and History, I study all the time, I read and write the pictographic and Paleo Ibryit, and I love to gather to discuss Scripture and learn from others, I am thankful to have come upon this post as it has helped alot.
hi yahuwahrocks
We like to discuss different viewpoints here. so what do you believe now?
What part is false?
jews are academic? No, some jews are just clueless morons.. have fun waiting and waiting,.. HE has shown up Already and will again…. you have been Blinded…… WAKE UP! How many people have to report Miracles in the Name of JESUS for you to See? How many spiritual interactions with the HOLY ONE/JESUS does one have to report for one to believe… Hey, that is your right to deny but in the end it is YOUR destruction….. Because as it says in the New Testament- shake the dust off your feet from the homes of non-believers….. Academic? Please.. how about arrogant…. GO to a Christian Church and LEARN… Yes, take THAT chance!
hi Bill
Yes, they are academically oriented. They believe that Christians just make up reports about Jesus. After all, why should they believe Christians who have persecuted them for 2000 years, and put them through the holocaust?
yes, they are also clueless. WE have to use scriptures from the old testament to show that Jesus fulfilled them, and that some were meant to be fulfilled later.
Lets not forget that in the past Jews persuceted Christans, Early Christans were killed in the the templs of God by Saul who is now know as paul. Not everybody that was involved in the Holcast were christans. Hitler has abandon his faith for secular humanst beliefs long ago. He was raised Catholic and had a jewish mother I believe. The problem is that Christans vote without using their moral vaules. I never understood why Christans can support abortion, while in the book of Jeremiah it says I knew you while you are fomring in the womb. Not to mention Christains still eat pork.
hi Ryan
I think what you see is about 90% professing their faith, and about 10% actually living it.
lol, you have alot of those ppl around nowadays which is why no one can trust anyone.
amen
Ryan,
I realize that you wrote the above awhile ago now, but even though you may not receive it, I write this for others as well.
1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron ;
3 Forbidding to marry , and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
6 If thou put the brethren in remembrance of these things, thou shalt be a good minister of Jesus Christ, nourished up in the words of faith and of good doctrine, whereunto thou hast attained .
7 But refuse profane and old wives’ fables, and exercise thyself rather unto godliness.
1 Timothy 4:1-7.
Simply the True Word of God the Father and the Son.
Praise be to Yeshua the KING of kings and LORD of lords. Amen.
Love,
a.
Jesus Christ is grace and truth. God the Father resists the pride of life. No man knows the day or the hour? Day is called light, time is the hour. A wicked man follows after the sunlight as their god. The Mayans were sun worshippers like America is today. (Luke 21:25) Who change the times and seasons? Why did America, mystery Babylon pushed back the present time an hour, then spring forward ahead an hour. How can the no man ever know the hour? Time change began in Jerusalem, is that a lie! The world is on Jerusalem time. They say Columbus discovered America 520 years ago, minus the 400 years of affliction for the Negroes / Judah equals man’s own wickedness 120 year life span. (Genesis 6:5) Remember God is rest (Hebrews 4:3). Even him Satan is peace, *Luke 19:42 Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this day, the things which belong unto peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes.
Do ye not know the saints shall judge the world? The scriptures of St. Matthew, St. Mark, St. Luke and St. John. Remember Paul (*1st Corinthians 15:10 But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.) Noah, Moses, Lot, Jacob, all found grace. And the Lord gave Joseph favor and grace in the eyes of the pharaoh. *Luke 2:51 And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man. (The world forgot about the curse on every firstborn! Jacob was cursed for his pretending to be Esau *Deu 28:68) What are human rights? Man decides that issue. What are civil rights, man tell us what is to be fair. What are birthrights? Does it comes from the womb. (Psalm 58:3 The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.) *Ezekiel 3:3 And he said unto me, Son of man, cause thy belly to eat and fill thy bowels with this roll that I give thee. Then did I eat it; and it was in my mouth as honey for sweetness. *Revelation 10:9 And I went unto the angel, and said unto him, Give me the little book. And he said unto me, Take it, and eat it up; and it shall make thy belly bitter, but it shall be in thy mouth sweet as honey. *Luke 18:32 For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on. *Acts 5:30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree.
Who is calling God a liar? The world is worshipping the star of David, why? *Amos 5:25 But ye have borne the tabernacle of your Moloch and Chiun your images, the star of your god, which he made to yourselves. *Acts 7:43 Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch, and the star of your god Remphan, figures which ye made to worship them: and I will carry you away beyond Babylon. *1st Kings 18:21 And Elijah came unto all the people, and said, How long halt ye between two opinions? if the Lord be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered him not a word. *Jude 11 Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and pershished in the gainsaying of Core. {Those who say, Am I my brother’s keeper? Followed Cain the first murder (John 8:44) with their vagabond shoes on.} (Christianity, where is the Word of God? Religion, where is the word of the Lord? All the world knows is to say I, my & we, the lovers of themselves first. Love truth, hate opinions) The Holy Spirit is for the world, do you tests the spirits, prove all things? The Holy Ghost brings us to thy Father. *Luke 3:16 he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire. *Hebrews 12:29 For our God is a consuming fire. *Acts 8:18-19 And when Simon saw that through laying on of the Apostles’ hands the Holy Ghost was given, he offered them money, Saying, Give me also this power, that whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost. (Lk 22:31) *2nd John 9-10 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed:(*Hebrews 6:1-2 not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.)
dear kevobx
This star of Remphan claim does not apply to the Jewish people, who just happen to have a star on their flag.
that is a witch hunt and a myth started by someone antisemitic on the internet
America has stars on its flag too.
The Remphan star has 8 points, not 6.
Israel’s flag is a prayer shawl to honor YHVH, their true God, and the star reminds them of their King David, through whom was promised the Messiah.
So your scriptures are misapplied.
Where is Jacob and his sons their bloodline? Only a wicked person would attached themselves to another man’s family lineage, by the way of ism. The word semetic is not found in the Word of God. Wake up, Syria came before Israel was ever born, see the indignation happening now reading (Isaiah 10:5 O Assyrian, the rod of mine anger, and the staff in their hand in mine indignation) *Genesis 35:5 And they journeyed: and the terror of God was upon the cities that were round about them, and they did not pursue after the sons of Jacob. *1st Chronicles 1:34 And Abraham begat Isaac. The sons of Isaac; Esau and Israel. *Acts 2:34 For David is not ascended into the heavens: but he said himself, The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand. *Psalm 109:6 Set thou a wicked man over him, and let Satan stand at his right hand. (What did Christ tell us about those on the left hand? *Matthew 25:41* What did Abraham tell Lot about the right hand and left hand? *Genesis 13:9* (At the end will be the twelve tribes, the children of Israel and no one else. God gave us heritage, man gave us culture.) Dan is the serpent by the way and Ephraim are the Puerto Ricans who are called hispanics now. Remember, Judah are the Negroes, and the coloreds are those following the Esau culture. How can man fight against grace and truth? Salvation is with Jacob and Joseph. The world is worshipping king David and his son Solomon, who were not saved by the Most High.
you have a lot of crazy ideas. your manipulation of scriptures does no prove your point.
No one worships king david.
Judah are the negroes???? that is stupid.
you are full of error.
Is Jeshua the end of all genealogies as far as Isreal is concerned? Is He not the end of all things prophetic and the fulfillment of and purpose of all prophecy? Jeshua has received all the promises, as a Jew, as Messiah and King and we receive the same through Him. All things are His and it is His good pleasure to give us good things according to His will and purpose. Once we were dead but now alive to God our Father. He has taken away the wall of separation, the barrier between us and Him. We are all one in Christ, all free men/women, brothers, sisters, one family. Jeshua has done this great work! Unity. For those who love Him.
Maybe our idea of a trinity is what does most damage. That concept was never part of the early church, nor was it in the Bible until later translations suddenly showed it. It came from a Byzantine monk and was introduced to broker peace between Western and Eastern Christians. A political agenda removed from reality.
Isaiah 9:6 as well as John 1 states very clearly that Jesus is God. Perhaps we also need to bear in mind two things, namely:
1. Metaphors, figurative speech.
2. That Jesus who is God lived in a human body that died on the cross and so did he die only after God (who is spirit) had left him. He even cried out “My God, why have You forsaken me” before he died. In the original language it means “why have you departed from me”.
6 For a child has been born to us,
a son has been given to us.
He shoulders responsibility
and is called:
Extraordinary Strategist,
Mighty God,
**Everlasting Father**,
Prince of Peace.
Isaiah 9:6
A child…..a son….Everlasting Father……in my Bible, one and the same Person! Not three persons as most churches teach their flocks. I do hope that at least one Jew reads here and is elated to find the Biblical truth! And then accepts Jesus as God!
Perhaps we need to return to the Truth ourselves before attempting to teach others or perceptions of the truth. Christianity is powerless because they have reduced Jesus to be the incarnation of a missing angel, or to the mere son of God and stripped Him of being divine. More so, all have in their minds this guy riding a donkey or cursing a tree or making more wine after the party-goers already had more than 500 liters of it. They see the limp flesh on the cross, they see a guy wearing a robe and sandals, but seldom do we see this risen Jesus who was not even recognizable to one of His most intimate lady friends. John 20:14 tells that story. Ever seen a picture of Him depicting Him in His risen state? Go, check the nearest bookstore and go through all the different children’s Bibles. See if you can find the risen Christ Jesus depicted anywhere.
14 When she had said this, she turned around and saw Jesus standing there, but she did not know that it was Jesus.
15 Jesus said to her, “Woman, why are you weeping? Who are you looking for?” Because she thought he was the gardener, she said to him, “Sir, if you have carried him away, tell me where you have put him, and I will take him.” John 20:14-15 (Free version of New English Translation with limited notes)
We should not even try to convince Jews as long as we believe in fantasies created by men instead of what is written clearly in the Bible.
Believe in rapture? Think again, is Jesus a liar? Read Matthew 24 attentively and see how modern Christianity is misaligned with what Jesus had been teaching Himself.
OK, so what next will we tell the Jews about Jesus………..
Christians believe that Jesus is also Holy Spirit to begin with.
But if we read Isaiah 42:1. God said I WILL PUT MY SPIRIT ON HIM. Which befits prophet Muhammad (pbuh) as he received divine guidance at later age.
Thus it is not Jesus, as he was born with Holy Spirit strengthening him (Muslims point of view).
From Chrisitan point of view, Jesus = Holy spirit.
dear nasr
I am christian and do not believe Jesus = holy spirit. Most Christians do not believe that either. Jesus and holy spirit are separate, and they are separate from the Father God, who empowers them.
There is one christian group, called the Oneness Pentecostals, or Jesus only, that believe the Father = Jesus= holy spirit as all the same person, but they are a very small minority. They think that Jesus was the father in heaven, came to earth as Jesus, and sent himself back as the holy spirit after the Jesus form departed. this is completely wrong, and does not match anything in the bible.
Jesus received the holy spirit at his baptism, which was a special empowerment by God, by John the baptist when he was about 30 years old. however, God and the holy spirit were always with him from birth, as you say.
I apologize that there is confusion like this. It shows what happens when people start their own ideas, and do not adhere to what the holy texts say.
Greetings!
I am a Christian. I’m a Science and theology student. Axtually, I was looking for supporting information for a research paper I need. I came across your wsbsite.
I read the first 5 lines or so. I believe that your questions are valid. However, the responses themselves are in the teachings of Christ in the way Christians have followed them thier walk. Ex. The snake told eve she would not die. She did indeed die, a spiritual death rather then a physical one. All the teachings of the Bible, ○including the new testament; leading up to the crucifixion, reflects back to that one event ●Without contradiction.
Anyway,
Please hit this youtube link, it speaks to the validity of Christ as Messiah and it also address the migration (or the lack of there of Jews retuning).
Perry Stone is an ○extremely well versed teacher / pastor anointed with knowledge, understanding and wisdom of the book of Revelation.
He has studied ○extensively with your israeli rabbies, in Israel (I think since the 80’s).
He’s extremely well respected….
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RcANyiQwy6k
If this link leads nowhere, the video name on YouTube is:
The end time battle at the gates.
I’m sure he has vids Address your concerns…
GOD Bless Israel. You might believe in the Lord and Savior. However, we will never stop praying for peace in Israel. May Jesus keep her in the palm of his hand, as written.
Best!
Jolie
dear jolie
I am wondering what you think my views are, as you are referring me to perry stone, whom I agree with.
not all prophecies were to be fulfilled at the time of Yeshua, which is what the jews expected.
the reason is why……then we do a bible study from there.
which is why i put this link in the post
there are also OTHER links at the end of that linked post.
have a look at them too.
god bless you!
Hello Jolie,
It is a blessing that you came to Heaven Awaits. There are many pages to explore within Heaven Awaits.
I watched the Perry Stone message you posted and have watched him one or twice before. I prefer Derek Prince books/videos (Spiritual Warfare) and Mark Blitz teaching videos.
Within the message you posted, Perry briefly discusses Ishtar. But, Perry stops short of explaining the depth of the subject. He said that he knows a great deal but does not think the audience can handle it.
If you would like to know more about Ishtar, which Perry Stone knows full well – please read this link below.
Ancient Babyon’s chief deity is “Ishtar” who is “Mother of Harlots”.
As Alexander Hislop, in his book “The Two Babylons”, identifies Isis as the Egyptian name for the Babylonian goddess “Ishtar” – who is also the same as Athena (Greece), Minerva (Egypt and Greece), Astarte (Syria), Cybele (Rome), Ashtoreth (Israel), and Diana (Ephesus).
Ishtar (who is represented by the Statue of Liberty) was known in ancient Babylon, as the goddess of personal freedom.
You see, a French Freemason artist designed a statue, representing the modern (1800 style), Ishtar.
The French government (formed out of a Masonic system/model constitution like ours), gave the people of US our statue in commemoration of the first Masonic republic 100 year anniversary (1776-1876). The artist constructed three statues of Ishtar and NYC harbor is home to the largest statue. There is one in Paris.
http://yahushua.net/babylon/liberty/whore.htm
The following was taken from, “America the Babylon” by Richard Coombs:
“Ishtar was called the matron goddess of prostitution because she promoted sexual freedom. Indeed, she had invented the concept. Slaves considered her their goddess in the hopes of winning their freedom. Many women who gained freedom later turned to prostitution to survive and thereby retained Libertas as their goddess, especially if they became priestesses in the Libertas cult. Libertas was also a goddess of war in order to fight for freedom. She was also referred at times as the goddess of victory because freedom must have victory in order to survive. This goddess was also the goddess of immigrants. The whole idea of immigration connoted the idea of freedom. Her popularity was also unique because of her unique doctrine of hearing personal prayers. This unique doctrine was something that most of the pagan deity doctrines were not disposed towards.
We know that this goddess existed because of the records left behind to us. We have the ancient writings of Cicero who writes of this goddess and her Temple on the Aventine Way in Rome. She was depicted on some Roman coins as wearing a freedom cap and having a wreath along with a spear or sometimes a sword. Such coin images were not the only depictions. Sometimes she was well robed and at other times seductively unclothed in both sculptures and paintings. We know of Libertas being referred to as the Mother of Harlots by the famous Roman historian (and senator) Cicero’s writings. Cicero indicates that she was also a very early goddess of the Greeks even before early Roman civilization developed.”
The following is from a website, which sells pagan statues of Ishtar and other pagan idols:
“In Babylonian culture, Ishtar was known as ‘she who endowed the king with prestige.’ Thought to engage in periodic ritual sacrifice of their kings, Ishtar’s priestesses were credited with bringing forth a bountiful harvest…Today, this Lady can bless your life with prosperity.
In her terrifying aspect, she descends like a storm, riding a lion and bearing weapons of war. She is surrounded by her sacred emblems: the star, light of the land, the scepter of power, the calendar moon, the eye of providence, the serpent of divine wisdom, and the magical tree of life. In Babylon, her temples were served by powerful priestesses well versed in rituals of sacred sexuality.”
Do you see the connection between Ishtar (Queen of Heaven, mystery Babylon) and the culture/history of the United States?
I would hope Perry Stone would be more direct with his ministry and not just drop a name like Ishtar.
This “freedom” (Ishtar) is also within the cultures of France, England and across Europe. It around the world, operating within a “republic” form of government (Russia has a parliament – in name only).
There is a world wide central banking system that connect the “free world” (including China). There are 13 central banks, which govern monitory policy and exchange rates around the world.
There are two phrases on the great seal of the United States, which you can see on the back side of a dollar bill.
The Latin words “E Pluribus Unum” means “Out of many; one.”
The Latin words “Annuit Conceptis” translated – “New World Order”
If Parry Stone wanted to prepare his flock for what he should know is coming to NYC and the USA (Rev. 18), then he would explain Ishtar and the statue in NYC that represents “mother goddess”.
As for the Jews and Hebrews – I think that Romans 11 will begin to be fulfilled in the coming months. When we see the Ark of the Covenant come forth – then we will know it has begun.
Many think the last Jubilee is 2017, entering into God’s rest (Hebrew chapter 4).
Some believers think (based on solid evidence) that we are within “Daniel’s week”. It began 2009/2010 and ends 2016/2017.
Marianne has linked a presentation on the right side of the page titled “Daniel’s Timeline”.
This is a good, very concise presentation by Dewy Burton. There are 12 segments each about 10 minutes so you can watch a little bit at a time.
The link below is segment 1 of 12. Mr. Burton produced the video in 2006.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=S1bkB1nShSU
God bless you in these last days.
Blessings
Psalm 27
I Believe That Our Lord And Savior Jesus Christ Was Rejected By The
Jews That They Didn’t Believe Him As Their Along Waited Messiah An
d The Son Of God And So They Crucified Jesus On The Cross As A P
unishment Against The Order Of The Jewish Authorities!
No those prophecies are not all fulfilled, but a lot are. Jesus will return and fullfill the rest of the prophecies. So far he is probably the closest to fulfilling all of the prophecies.
I don’t think you can be neutral about those prophecies…
First you probably accepted jesus before checking any prophecies. So you accepted him before any proofs.
And what does the New testament say:
Jesus said to his disciples: “Things that cause people to stumble are bound to come, but woe to anyone through whom they come. It would be better for them to be thrown into the sea with a millstone tied around their neck than to cause one of these little ones to stumble. Luke 17:1-2
So basically, it is better to commit suicide than doubting Jesus as the messiah.
And what is the consequence of such a denial, on top of being seen as a Judas by your family and friends who all believe in Jesus?
But whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven.
Hell. (And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night)
Furthermore, 1 John 2:2 says “Who is the liar? It is whoever denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a person is the antichrist–denying the Father and the Son.”
So if you deny Jesus, as per the new testament, you are an anti-Christ.
Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 1John 4:1-2
The new testament tells you you can test if someone is from G-d, does not allows one to test Jesus claims.
What else can I say? That as per the New Testament, it’s all about believing. You have eternal life if you believe in the son. As Jesus said ” “You believe because you have seen me. Blessed are those who believe without seeing me.” John 20:29 And “Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven” Matthew 18:3.
So a Christian is not ask to wonder if Jesus is really the messiah, but to accept it. If you have doubt, you should fight those doubts! So the Christian put the cart before the horse by accepting Jesus as god and saviour before really checking if he is as James 1 say “If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach, and it will be given to him. 6 But let him ask in faith, with no doubting, for he who doubts is like a wave of the sea driven and tossed by the wind. ”
So the good Christian who doubt if a prophecy is really fulfil must believe and have faith that Jesus is who he says he is, in Jesus name on top of that!
“He that answers a matter before he hears it, it is folly and shame unto him” Proverbs 18:3
Finally let examine Exodus 23:8 “”Do not accept a bribe, for a bribe blinds those who see and twists the words of the innocent.”
This does not talk about Jesus, of course. But Christians who accept Jesus as their lord and saviour have the reward of Heaven as a bribe. On top of that they have the punishment of hell if they refuse Jesus as their saviour. This is, in a way equivalent to a bribe, thus they have been blinded and cannot see the Hebrew Scripture for what it really say.
your point here is……?
Are they really fulfilled? I don’t think you are really neutral and able to determine fairly if they really talk about Jesus
the article states that some have not been fulfilled yet.
so are you saying they are?
what do you believe and not believe?
I am saying that Jesus fulfilled no prophecy. 0 is the number… And because you put your allegiance to your god, you cannot judge without bias if Jesus did really fulfil the prophecies that you say he fulfilled!
jesus fulfilled quite a few prophecies.
daniel predicted he would be killed, and that is what happened.
jesus was born in bethlehem, as predicted.
just 2 examples.
Micah… “But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though you are small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come for me one who will be ruler over Israel. Jesus never ruled over Israel.. It’s non-sense to say that it was fulfilled.
Daniel predicted he would be killed…
Where in the 70 weeks? I guess you never did the count to see if it really fits Jesus! A year has 365 days, not 360!
jesus will rule in israel on his return. he declined the position the first time.
daniel 9
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
Well, second-coming prophecies are what it is…. Not happened yet. That’s what christian do. They said that those things are proofs, but it have not happened!
Sorry, for Daniel 9, you got it all wrong in the translation…
Seventy weeks [of years] have been decreed upon your people and upon the city of your Sanctuary to terminate the transgression and to end sin, and to expiate iniquity, and to bring eternal righteousness, and to seal up vision and prophet, and to anoint the Holy of Holies. כדשָׁבֻעִים שִׁבְעִים נֶחְתַּךְ עַל עַמְּךָ | וְעַל עִיר קָדְשֶׁךָ לְכַלֵּא הַפֶּשַׁע וּלְהָתֵם (כתיב וּלְחָתֵם) חַטָּאוֹת וּלְכַפֵּר עָוֹן וּלְהָבִיא צֶדֶק עֹלָמִים וְלַחְתֹּם חָזוֹן וְנָבִיא וְלִמְשֹׁחַ קֹדֶשׁ קָדָשִׁים:
25And you shall know and understand that from the emergence of the word to restore and to rebuild Jerusalem until the anointed king [shall be] seven weeks, and [in] sixty-two weeks it will return and be built street and moat, but in troubled times. כהוְתֵדַע וְתַשְׂכֵּל מִן מֹצָא דָבָר לְהָשִׁיב וְלִבְנוֹת יְרוּשָׁלִַם עַד מָשִׁיחַ נָגִיד שָׁבֻעִים שִׁבְעָה וְשָׁבֻעִים שִׁשִּׁים וּשְׁנַיִם תָּשׁוּב וְנִבְנְתָה רְחוֹב וְחָרוּץ וּבְצוֹק הָעִתִּים:
26And after the sixty-two weeks, the anointed one will be cut off, and he will be no more, and the people of the coming monarch will destroy the city and the Sanctuary, and his end will come about by inundation, and until the end of the war, it will be cut off into desolation. כווְאַחֲרֵי הַשָּׁבֻעִים שִׁשִּׁים וּשְׁנַיִם יִכָּרֵת מָשִׁיחַ וְאֵין לוֹ וְהָעִיר וְהַקֹּדֶשׁ יַשְׁחִית עַם נָגִיד הַבָּא וְקִצּוֹ בַשֶּׁטֶף וְעַד קֵץ מִלְחָמָה נֶחֱרֶצֶת שֹׁמֵמוֹת:
27And he will strengthen a covenant for the princes for one week, and half the week he will abolish sacrifice and meal- offering, and on high, among abominations, will be the dumb one, and until destruction and extermination befall the dumb one.וְהִגְבִּיר בְּרִית לָרַבִּים שָׁבוּעַ אֶחָד וַחֲצִי הַשָּׁבוּעַ יַשְׁבִּית | זֶבַח וּמִנְחָה וְעַל כְּנַף שִׁקּוּצִים מְשֹׁמֵם וְעַד כָּלָה וְנֶחֱרָצָה תִּתַּךְ עַל שׁוֹמֵם:
You just can’t put the 7 weeks and the 62 weeks together.
And it begs the question: Do you still sin?
And anointed on could be seen as the High priest, who was definitely cut of. There is nothing to do with Jesus!
there was no anointed priest killed at the time of jesus
Because you have not made the calculations properly… The whole 70 weeks finishes at the destruction of the second temple
https://jewsforjudaism.org/knowledge/articles/answers/jewish-polemics/texts/daniel-9-a-true-biblical-interpretation/
daniel 9:
going forth of the command to rebuild….artaxerxes 445-457 BC…
62 weeks x 7 = 483 years
457 + 483 = 26 AD
445 + 483 = 38 AD
temple destroyed in 70 AD, so you missed it…..
who was killed between 26 AD and 38 AD?
answer Jesus…..
history has no record of the high priest being killed during that time
the reason 62 weeks is separate from the last week is because messiah got cut off……moshiach….
time does not start again until he returns, hope you guys get it right this time, for your sake
the people of the (bad) prince (of rome) destroy the city,,,and until the end ( when the last week happens, war is determined for Israel…. Israel cannot seem to get rid of the romans or the vatican.
the bad prince of rome never made a covenant for one week ( 7 years) in 70 AD before he destroyed jerusalem and the temple, so it is referring to the future…..
the same group ( romans. or their descendents) and their leader will broker a peace deal with israel, or a covenant with many aBOUT Issrael, maybe allowing a 3rd temple, but in the middle of the week, 3.5 years, he will betray Israel…and the sacrifices, offerings, mitzvahs will stop…will be illegal….
the last beast of daniel (daniel 7) is what you will be dealing with..a whole power, now WHO is that right now? who subdued 3 kings so far? think Libya, yemen, egypt…..now muslim brotherhood in control….who helped them? see also daniel 8:23-25…it will be this fierce sinister king ( president).
daniel 7 says the time of jacob’s trouble will be a time, times, and half a time..3.5 years. ( verses 24- 25), see also daniel 12, verse 7
this beast leader is going to completely shatter Israel in his deceit, …so he is muslim in his mentality..and works with muslim brotherhood….guess who that is?
at this time Michael will stand up for Isael, when israel cries out to heaven..at this time, Moschiach returns…
if you look at daniel 7, the son of man ( moshiach) appeard before he ancient of days and receives the kingdom….as the war against the saints comes to a climax in verse 22, the MOST HIGH judges in favor of the saints..and it is time for them to posses the kingdom..
how does moshiach fit into this. daniel 8 says the evil king fights against the prince of princes and loses…so moshiach comes to fight the evil king, and establish the kingdom of heaven on earth, bringing deliverance to the saints and having them share in this kingdom.
but you might say….this is just the first trip for moshiach
no it isn’t
he got killed in daniel 9, at the end of the 62 weeks.
micah 5:2 says the one to be ruler in Israel was born in bethlehem, he was from everylasting ( more than human here)
then he ( messiah) gives them up for a time, ( since he got killed), until the time she gives birth ( 1948). verse 3 when the remnant returns.
the messiaih comes in verse 4 to establish peace, and in verse 6, it indicates the time will be when the assyrian enters the land. think ezechiel 38 here.
the time for ezechiel 38 is now……
does this help, make more sense?
it is a puzzle the christians could not explain either, because they are wrapped up in their own ideology, and think a jewish messiah is coming for them, but not israel.
Christians have had their head up their butt too long to be useful to anyone…
If you try dates for other decrees, you get NOTHING
Maybe because there is no decree in the original hebrew?
It’s the word d’var (Word). So you pick and choose the decree that fits Jesus? That’s the way it word? Maybe, the NT writer knew that it did not fit Jesus and that’s why they did not put that prophecy?
like I said, pick another leader, like cyrus, add 483 years, and you get NOTHING
You could have read the link I sent. Anyway, your date don’t match with any of the decrees and none of what is written in Daniel 9, Jesus fulfilled. It’s easy to buy the lie, it’s close enough. We arrive at 39 AD if we use one of the three decrees (not word), and well close enough. We can remove a few days per year! DONE… Jesus fulfilled it! AWESOME, I can keep on worshipping my demi-god jesus!
That makes me think… Can you really be neutral when you look at the prophecies?
https://therealmessianic.wordpress.com/2016/02/23/can-you-be-neutral/
if you believe the bible at all, SOMEThiNG was supposed to happen after SOME decree to rebuild jerusalem.
I suggest you just wait and see who shows up as messiah.
if jesus shows up, then he is it.
if someone else shows up, then we all will still accept him.
I think you have a hang up because christians have been so rotten to jews over time…..
but what they think they believe and what the bible says can be very different.
I gave you a point by point explanation taken straight from jewish prophecy….I did not use new testament scriptures.
did you see the video of the young israeli boy who had a life after death experience and was told messiah was coming very soon, maybe even this year we will see the jacob’s trouble start?
he was not told who the messiah was, but he was coming soon.
I try to be neutral…I sit on the fence between christians and jews
I have my beliefs but they do not match 100% with either group
Let’s wait and see….
https://therealmessianic.wordpress.com/2016/02/24/the-false-prophet/
“I try to be neutral…I sit on the fence between christians and jews”
You can’t stay neutral…
Elijah went before the people and said, “How long will you waver between two opinions? If the LORD is God, follow him; but if Baal (lord) is god, follow him.” But the people said nothing.
the point is not neutrality
the point is I do not agree 100% with either jews or christians…to me they are both wrong on some things and right on other things.
I also see your realmessianic page as part wrong and part right.
what he quotes is right but his interpretation is wrong
jesus said his kingdom was spiritual, not physical, at the time.
where it says
Mat 16:28 say:
“Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom.”
this did happen. jesus took 3 disciples up the mountain, and met with elijah and moses….the men were able to witness the glory of god in that meeting…..also, john had heavenly visions of the kingdom of god, which he wrote about…
jesus also appeared to his followers after the resurrection…more spiritual experience / fulfillment
and on pentecost, the holy spirit came down and baptised all the followers with heavenly fire….more fulfillment
so the fulfillment of the prophecy was a spiritual fulfillment…he had already made it clear he did not want to be king at the time of the roman occupation.
there is only one god and that is the father in heaven, even jesus said so…..
and jesus came to teach torah, preach repentance, and die for man’s sins…..while the torah indicates man cannot pay for another’ sins, this is because every man is sinful…a blemished, spotted person….however, jesus was without sin, pure without spot or blemish, and he could offer himself as a sacrifice for sins….with the father’s approval.
he did not come to be king at that time.
as I explained, there is a promise to return, and I believe the father will send him back, just as elijah will return…
Or Jesus is god or he is an Idol, there is no middle there…
the FATHER (ABBA) is God, jesus ( Yeshua) is his spirit Son.
Jesus made that very clear…he constantly referred to doing the will of his Father in heaven…..that the Father was greater than he was
John 17
17 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:
2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.
7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.
8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
Are you a polytheist?
no
there is ONE GOd and that is the FAther.
christians have added jesus the son, and the holy spirit to make 3, but that is not what jesus taught.
Jesus is God/a god as per john 1. He is worshipped and that is clear. So you believe in G-d and a second god, Jesus who is your lord and saviour.
john 1 needs to be interpreted in light of other scriptures
yes he is my savior, the father sent him for that purpose
Yes, that’s what the new testament said. But 2 lords, 2 saviours, 2 redeemers is two gods. Why would G-d share his glory when He said he would not?
first answer the other question
the catholic church started this theological mess. they wanted a triune god that would match up with the roman gods, so they could “sell” the religion better to the romans. then the protestants picked up on this and kept going with it, since they did not have a brain to work with either.
the FAther is in heaven, but there are other beings in heaven with him that do his bidding…jesus and the holy spirit, the angels, cherubim, seraphim, etc. the point jesus made was that he was in heaven with the father before he came to earth, and he was going back to the father when he finished his work on earth….
but jesus is your lord? so you still are polytheist!
do you understand what Lord means?
are you jewish, or something else?
baal is also called lord. Of course we can have human master, but it’s clear in the context that Jesus was more… Every knees will bow to him!
Am I a Jew? https://therealmessianic.wordpress.com/about/
just give me a straight answer.
being part of a messianic congregation does not give me a specific answer, you gentile or jew?
Oups, I will add that in my info… I am not Jewish
now we are getting somewhere.
the hebrew word for Lord is Adon….it means owner
adonai means my owner, or my lord
the head of a house is adon.
if mr and mrs smith own a house, and mr smith is the head of the house, then in hebrew, he is addressed as Adon Smith
jesus is the owner of this earth, the father gave it to him.
while the father is Adon over all creation., the son is adon over the earth.
obviously, earth is part of creation, so the father is also adon over the earth, but he allows jesus this governance
so yes there can be two lords, and even jesus submits to the father, and does his will.
the father is god, and jesus is the heavenly son
You still have 2 gods, 2 lords and 2 gods. This is still considered polytheism.
I am not going to argue with you. I do not even think you know what you believe.
there is ONE god, who is the father, and he has a son, who is not god but the son of god.
get a life…..
Here Marianne, why don’t you believe me? Polytheism is not necessary wrong for most religions:
Let’s start with J Witness.
In the beginning was the Word,+ and the Word was with God,+ and the Word was a god. John 1:1
The word, Jesus as a god.
Also, as per John 20:28, Thomas said:
“In answer Thomas said to him: “My Lord and my God!””
Note that the word god is in hebrew Elohim and in greek theos and both can be translated as “G-d”, “god”, “angels”, “gods” for Elohim,
https://www.blueletterbible.org…
https://www.blueletterbible.org…
We have in the Hebrew Bible Deuteronomy 6:4 “Listen, O Israel: Jehovah our God is one Jehovah.”
Thus The L-rd/YVHV is one, but they also believe Jesus is “a god / angel”.
That angel/god, Jesus, everybody will bow to and confess he is lord:
so that in the name of Jesus every knee should bend”of those in heaven and those on earth and those under the ground+” 11 and every tongue should openly acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord+ to the glory of God the Father. Phil 2:10
For the Mormon, we can add Matthew 2:2 & 11, where Jesus is clearly worshiped
Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.
And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him
Jesus is, as per the two previous verse a god/angel and he is the saviour.
According to JW’s theories, Jesus is also the anger Michael. Thus there is the L-RD, and Jesus is Gabriel, a second god.
https://www.jw.org…
For the Mormons, we can read in one of their article:
“From the Prophet’s account of the First Vision and from his other teachings, we know that the members of the Godhead are three separate beings. The Father and the Son have tangible bodies of flesh and bones, and the Holy Ghost is a personage of spirit”
You see: “three separate beings.” If those three separate being are not a trinity, then those are three gods.
The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as man”s; the Son also; but the Holy Ghost has not a body of flesh and bones, but is a personage of Spirit. Were it not so, the Holy Ghost could not dwell in us.
https://www.lds.org…
We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost.
https://www.lds.org…
23 For we saw him, even on the right hand of God; and we heard the voice bearing record that he is the Only Begotten of the Father”
https://www.lds.org…
Listen to the words of Christ, your Redeemer, your Lord and your God. Behold, I came into the world not to call the righteous but sinners to repentance; the whole need no physician, but they that are sick; wherefore, little children are whole, for they are not capable of committing sin; wherefore the curse of Adam is taken from them in me, that it hath no power over them; and the law of circumcision is done away in me. Mormoni 8:8
https://www.lds.org…
Thus because both believe the The L-rd is different than Jesus. And that Jesus is god, their lord and their saviour and as per the new testament worshipped, we can conclude that they believe in at least 2 gods, and that is polytheism.
Thank you
I really don’t care about other religions.
what do you believe ?
I believe in the Hebrew Bible. Jesus was not the messiah because he fulfilled 0 prophecies.
ok so you are a convert to judaism
Well… no. I don’t need to convert. Not now at least.
ok so you are a gentile that thinks like a traditional jew
I came to the conclusion that Jesus could not be the messiah… Yes that’s what it is. And you are a Jew that believe in Jesus, Ironic isn’t it?
life is amazing, isn’t it? 🙂
Jesus is not our savior and he is surely not our God!
_ _ _ _ is the only Savior I need. I do not need Jesus to be saved. Isaiah 45 (The “None Besides Me” chapter along with “Ezekiel 18” and Bereshit (AKA Genesis) Chapters 1-11 are about all the Bible a non-Jew needs to be saved.
Be Righteous
1) Do not believe in a pagan god (Jesus was made into a pagan god 324 AD by Emperor Constantine)
2) Do Not Take The Holiest Of Names in Vain
3) Do not commit MURDER (Different than Killing)
4) Do not STEAL
5) Do not eat living flesh
6) Do not commit sex crimes (sex with animals, homo, sex for rituals)
(May have been also adultery but marriage is not a must for Gentiles so most likely the sex laws were about the obvious wrongs and blasphemies that go against mankind)
7) Set Up A Court System to Judge those who break laws 1-6
This is what a non-jew must do to be saved and believing in a resurrection has nothing to do with it.
The Israelites are the chosen ones! Anyone who speaks against them has clearly not read the entire Bible.
I am a low servant of my MASTER. My goal in life is to serve HIM and only HIM. I serve no man and I praise no man. I was born in the U.S.A and I have no allegiance to the U.S.A or any other country. My Oath of Allegience is to my MASTER. I shall be HIS slave until the day that I die and I will never try to act as if I am as worthy as the least of HIS chosen. I will be lucky if I am allowed to serve all of HIS people
HaShem (The NAME) is my only Elohim and my only Savior.
(Jesus was a good guy but he was not and never will be my savior. That position belongs to the Sole Creator of the Universe.)
Pastor Darrell
darrell
for the most part I agree with you, but as YHVH sent Jesus to us, we must accept him.
the father is god, Jesus is Moshiach.